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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 19-07-2008, 10:52 AM
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Ian, Ive just realised we might be discussing two different points here, your talking about a snake with a weak venom that would rate extremely low on the LD50 chart, but also has a highly evolved venom delivery system so is still likely to evenomate with a bite, increasing the chances of having complications with the bite. Thus answering the question 'which DWA snake has the weakest venom'. Im talking about a snake with a significantly toxin venom, but with such a poor delivery system that a fatal bite would be highly unlikely, thus answering the question 'which snake is unlikely to kill you if it bites you'. Obviously this is only a matter of opinion. The question is hard to answer, its a bit like asking which sports bike is less likely to kill, all the snakes are on DWA for a reason, because they pose a threat to keepers.

Last edited by Azemiops; 19-07-2008 at 10:55 AM.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 19-07-2008, 12:48 PM
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If you expect to get bitten then maybe keeping venomous is not a wise decision at the moment. If you keep venomous then you want to aim to never get bitten.
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Old 21-07-2008, 01:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azemiops View Post
R.tigrinus has caused fatalities, but please find me on recorded fatality caused by Rhabdophis subminiatus. There have been cases where severe bites have been recorded, hence the reason they are on the DWA license, but i am suggesting that they are one of the snakes listed that i beleive to pose the least threat to keepers, because, being a small rear-fanged snake, they would struggle to get a fatal dose of venom into you.
I have read 2 conflicitng accounts, one which states subminiatus has caused a fatal bite, the other that it was tigrinus. I am happy to be corrected. An interesting observation was made by a friend who had a pair of rednecks. One bit the other, which died within minutes. Most venomous species, as far as I knew, are generally immune to their own venom, which would suggest that the red neck is somewhat potent. As an aside, mangroves have caused severe bites, and at upto 7', more than capable of engaging the fangs, which are situated under the eye, yet have been removed from the DWA, but rednecks are still on the list.
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Old 21-07-2008, 01:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azemiops View Post
Ian, Ive just realised we might be discussing two different points here, your talking about a snake with a weak venom that would rate extremely low on the LD50 chart, but also has a highly evolved venom delivery system so is still likely to evenomate with a bite, increasing the chances of having complications with the bite. Thus answering the question 'which DWA snake has the weakest venom'. Im talking about a snake with a significantly toxin venom, but with such a poor delivery system that a fatal bite would be highly unlikely, thus answering the question 'which snake is unlikely to kill you if it bites you'. Obviously this is only a matter of opinion. The question is hard to answer, its a bit like asking which sports bike is less likely to kill, all the snakes are on DWA for a reason, because they pose a threat to keepers.
Don't think we are taling about 2 different things. The question "which DWA snake has the weakest venom" is quite clear, and different to a poor or effective delivery system. I am happy to be corrected, as always, however, I would suggest that V. ursinii is the animal you are looking at.

The venom is barely effective on a grasshopper, let alone a mouse, which is the measure for the LD50 scale.

I think this does answer the question which DWA snake has the weakest venom. Effective delivery systems are totally different.
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Old 21-07-2008, 08:15 AM
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A quote from the guys first post

Quote:
Originally Posted by beardieman View Post
whats the least venomous snake
one that wont kill you if it bit
You answered 'whats the least venomous'
I answered 'one that wont kill you if it bit', obviously i interpreted this to mean LEAST likely to kill.
I still feel this will come down to a matter of opinion.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 21-07-2008, 08:32 AM
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to me this whole argument is benial, interestingly i watched a programme which stated the animal which kills more people using venom was the honey bee, after chatting with tigersnake, this could easily be interpreted this way, the fact that a reptile or other animal has venom is the fact that should be concentrated on, every reaction from a person is different, every bite is different even though the venom works in a certain way and all can have serious consequences,
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Old 21-07-2008, 10:35 AM
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Im not suggesting that any of the snakes being discussed are harmless, like you stated, complications can occur from any animal that has venom, especially if an allergic reaction takes place. I can see how this kind of diccussion might give the wrong impression to would-be DWA keepers, might be best to end it here.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 22-08-2008, 07:49 AM
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Default Don't mess with rednecks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ian14 View Post
I have read 2 conflicitng accounts, one which states subminiatus has caused a fatal bite, the other that it was tigrinus. I am happy to be corrected. An interesting observation was made by a friend who had a pair of rednecks. One bit the other, which died within minutes. Most venomous species, as far as I knew, are generally immune to their own venom, which would suggest that the red neck is somewhat potent. As an aside, mangroves have caused severe bites, and at upto 7', more than capable of engaging the fangs, which are situated under the eye, yet have been removed from the DWA, but rednecks are still on the list.
The red neck can nail you very effectively if it gets you on the finger, where it's fangs can easily penetrate.Also its venom is powerful.mouse Ld 50 is 1.29 (king cobra, 1.30, banded krait, 1.2
According to the late Joe Slowinsky it has caused one fatality in the U.S plus several close calls. I myself spent 9 days in ICU after getting bit and not removing the 'harmless garter snake' quickly enough.In my experience it is also a little unpredictable in terms of temprement so this makes it a high risk item for snake fans who like to get close to their pets.
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