Inroducing the fishless cycling....

[Esfa]

Originally Posted by Morgan Freeman

I thought a high level of NitrAtes weren't safe? They can be present, just not high.

most fish do fine upto about 200 ppm i think?

[Cleopatra the Royal]

Originally Posted by jaykickboxer

Im pretty sure a small reading of all of the above is ok as most tap water contained small levels , u need reverse osmosis in order to have zero Reading although even when cycling a tank I have no patientce so just rush and do regular water changes monitoring readings as long as u reduce feeding and do regular changes ur normally fine

never use 100% reverse osmosis water though, as the fish need the minerals to osmoregulate, and thats a fact. i would rather have a low ammonia/nitraite/nitrate count than none at all with reverse osmosis water.

[Cleopatra the Royal]

Originally Posted by Morgan Freeman

I thought a high level of NitrAtes weren't safe? They can be present, just not high.

sorry, yes thats true also. i accidentally cut off the part about the plants assimilating the nitrates. my mistake

Harry

[Fiw666]

The main danger from nitrate comes when adding fish to a high nitrate tank, the fish that have been in from earlier acclimatise to rising nitrate levels so are less affected by it.

i still think fish cycling is the best method but people have no patience when adding fish.
if the fish are added in small enough amounts, you get a quite safe cycle, providing the fish are not over fed.

[Morgan Freeman]

This is taking forever.

[igmillichip]

Originally Posted by Cleopatra the Royal

sorry, i found it difficult following the 'and then the bacteria does this ..... and then this bacteria does this...'

if anyone else is having the same problem, here is an extract that explains it more clearly (Nitrosomanas break down ammonia, Nitrobacter break down nitrites, plants assimilate nitrates):

"In a biologically immature aquarium, waste will build up as there are not the necessary bacteria to break it down. This will result in a large ammonia surge, followed by the colonisation of Nitrosomanas bacteria. A large nitrite surge will then occur, followed by the lengthy process of a colonisation of Nitrobacter bacteria. Only now can the nitrites be converted into nitrates, and the aquarium is safe for use."

Hope this helps.

Harry

The genera of bacteria quoted may not be applicable to all cases.

The quote also misses out the fact that much of the ammonia within a freshwater tank will come directly from the fishes gills.
The quote doesn't really explain where that initial ammonia surge comes from from waste if no bacteria are present.
I would even say that the quote is pretty misleading and may introduce extra confusion to the story.
It doesn't really address the importance of oxygen, pH, carbonate buffering, nor redox.
However, it is good in that emphasises the long time it takes the nitrate oxidising bacteria to get a hold. Whilst the nitrosofying bacteria (ammonia oxidisers) get going quite rapidly; it is the lengthy time for a decent colony of nitrifying bacteria (nitrate oxidisers) to get going that is the bit that gets people impatient.

ian

[caribe]

You can buy some chemicals that cycle the water quicker but its still not ideal. I put some bacteria in and leave the tank with plants and a bit of food in for around 21 days and then add fish.

Although I have at times had to fill up a tank and put fish in due to tanks breaking in the past. The filters have had bacteria in luckily but have had to use fresh water and filters when my big cichlids tank broke and I had to put them all in small holding tanks that I never had set up as I was not expecting that

They all survived but Its not something that I recommend.

My tank has been cycled for my Dovii/trimacs for 3 weeks now.

Nice and clean and have cycled the tank. I put some we firemouths in the other day to help and they have been charging around happily.

Ah gone are the days of winning a goldfish and throwing it in a bowl, good riddance IMO.

[Morgan Freeman]

Originally Posted by Morgan Freeman

This is taking forever.

Awwwwww n00b me.

[nicnet]

Fast way to fully cycle a tank that we used to use at the fish shop we had

Take a lump of steak. about 1 inch square.

put into the foot end of a NEW stocking. Drop into setup tank.

Leave for one week or until ammonia level hits 'off the scale'

Two days later, once ammonia starting to spike a bit, do a filter wash from another tank, either from a mate / shop. Any good fish shop will do this for you if you ask them. Alternate is to buy a filter culture although if they are not fresh they are useless

When taking steak chunk out, make sure you bag it up underwater first, its going to absolutely reeeeeek when you take it out.

Now you have one tank full of ammonia and your bacteria is starting to grow really fast. Once Ammonia hits 0, and nitrites have finished their spike and flow. Do a 1/4 water change, skim the water off from the top to get rid of any minor sludge that the steak treatment may have caused.

One fully functioning filter ready for fish. You will need to half stock this tank now to keep the filter from dying back from lack of ammonia.

Best done in contuntion with your friendly fishkeeper who can advise on the tests.


(edit)

you can skip the filter culture step and just wait it out after you remove the meat. This can take up to 3 weeks though at times for the bacteria to grow.

Bonus is. You cant kill the meat ;p
Cons. Well aside from the smell of the rotten meat when you take it out the tank, no cons. Just make sure you bag it and tie it underwater before you take it out.

[lexi21]

what about skimmer, people said it can reduce ammonia and save for tank