Animal Rights Activist

[essexchondro]

NO. the victorians did use them. and i agree with that way of thinking. i make no apologies. its an alternative.

So victorian science was better than the science of today?!?! And did victorian scientists have a better understanding of things than the scientists of today?

Science has come a long way in the last 100 plus years, why would you want to turn back the clock and why would you imply science has deteriorated in that time?

What you actually like are victorian ideas on crime and punishment...nothing to do with science (or at least it shouldn't be!).

[Lynne]

Originally Posted by essexchondro

So victorian science was better than the science of today?!?! And did victorian scientists have a better understanding of things than the scientists of today?

Science has come a long way in the last 100 plus years, why would you want to turn back the clock and why would you imply science has deteriorated in that time?

What you actually like are victorian ideas on crime and punishment...nothing to do with science (or at least it shouldn't be!).

well....watch the news, stabbings, rapes, kidnaps are on the increase. say i was a murderer. nowadays i am more likely to be caught. the thought of having a needle full of chemicals shoved in me. would make me think twice. and yes it has nowt to do with science. its just the anwer to something that has gone on for years. the government said years ago they would stop animal experiments if there were a viable alternative. this is. i know nothing about science. i do know about having things happen and finding out the punishment people will get is nothin compared to what families have to live with after a murder, or rape or a child has disappeared.
our society is more concerned with prisoners rights than victims rights. this cannot be correct surely.

oh and if were not for victorian scientists, we would not have the science we have today!!!
i really must go. look forward to catching up with this later.

[cooljules]

Originally Posted by cat1974

Hi all,
I decided to do a post here as some issues have been popping up with a few of my threads recently.

I'll explain. I am an AR activist. I am vegan and go to protests about fur/vivisection etc. I try to lie my life without hurting other life, basically.

This is who I am and I make no apologies for it. I would stand up for your right not to be hurt, for the right of your children not to be hurt, and of course for the right of the animals in your care not to be hurt.

I find RFUK wonderful. I came to snakes (my only reps so far) by accident as there was one about to be killed. I couldn't let an animal be killed so I said I'd take him. I came here, bought books, consulted my vet and asked my local herp dude for advice. Adam is doing soooooooo well now and is a big beautiful boy and I am thrilled and thank RFUK (my first port of call always) for that help.

I am still AR though.

I recently had a rescue siamese kitten and needed advice on siamese cats. I have had cats all my life but the breeding changes them and I wanted her to be happy. So I consulted a siamese site and got the advice I needed.

I never hide who I am. Ever. I am AR and bloody proud of it. I don't expect others to be (though I'd love if they were obviously). My Boyfriend eats meat and my family bred dogs (till my granny died - it was her hobby).

I know the way the media works and that many will think I am about to dig up their grannies......

It is NOT the case. I respect life end of story and as far as non-human animals are concerned yes, I have a serious problem with putting a price on life, but that is an issue that I will take up with anyone at their discretion. Discuss it yes, when you want to bring it up.

However if and when I am attacked I will defend myself pretty much like little Eve, rattle my tail a bit then bite!

I am a very easygoing person and can discuss anything rationally, but if my personal care of my "babies" is called into question I will basically fight back with all I have. Rescue is the one aspect of my life that I am bloomin proud of and I know I do well.

We are not crazy you know! Ask me any question about being AR and I will give you a straight answer.

Thanks and once again, thanks for all the advice with the snakes!
Cat
PS pics: http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/snake...pics-last.html

i eat meat and have leather...so i gues we cant be friends!

[essexchondro]

well....watch the news, stabbings, rapes, kidnaps are on the increase. say i was a murderer. nowadays i am more likely to be caught. the thought of having a needle full of chemicals shoved in me. would make me think twice. and yes it has nowt to do with science. its just the anwer to something that has gone on for years. the government said years ago they would stop animal experiments if there were a viable alternative. this is. i know nothing about science. i do know about having things happen and finding out the punishment people will get is nothin compared to what families have to live with after a murder, or rape or a child has disappeared.
our society is more concerned with prisoners rights than victims rights. this cannot be correct surely.

oh and if were not for victorian scientists, we would not have the science we have today!!!

See this is what I'm saying, you see today's society as relatively "lawless" and think that a return to victorian style punishment would act as a deterrant. You're talking about crime and punishment, you're not talking about how scientific experiments should/can be carried out to give good and worthwhile results.

If you want to punish criminals more harshly then fair enough, but why compromise the quality of todays science by suggesting that their punishment has to be incorporated into science and scientific experimenting?

Without victorian science of course we wouldn't have the science of today. But that's not saying that victorian science was better than today's science, is it? After all, we've had 100 plus years to further our understanding way beyond that of the victorians! A return to victorian crime and punishment is one thing, don't ruin science by dragging it back to that era too!

Keep the punishment of criminals entirely separate from science...unless, of course, you wish to politicise science and turn it into an emotional rather than an objective pursuit.

[AshMashMash]

Originally Posted by Lynne

i know nothing about science.

And thus why you cant really comment. You're saying testing on people is a viable alternative? You nothing about science, how can you say that? Do you know the numbers involved, or the process, or anything at all?

Dont be so rediculous...

[Pete Q]

Originally Posted by cat1974

Hi all,
I decided to do a post here as some issues have been popping up with a few of my threads recently.

I'll explain. I am an AR activist. I am vegan and go to protests about fur/vivisection etc. I try to lie my life without hurting other life, basically.

This is who I am and I make no apologies for it. I would stand up for your right not to be hurt, for the right of your children not to be hurt, and of course for the right of the animals in your care not to be hurt.

I find RFUK wonderful. I came to snakes (my only reps so far) by accident as there was one about to be killed. I couldn't let an animal be killed so I said I'd take him. I came here, bought books, consulted my vet and asked my local herp dude for advice. Adam is doing soooooooo well now and is a big beautiful boy and I am thrilled and thank RFUK (my first port of call always) for that help.

I am still AR though.

I recently had a rescue siamese kitten and needed advice on siamese cats. I have had cats all my life but the breeding changes them and I wanted her to be happy. So I consulted a siamese site and got the advice I needed.

I never hide who I am. Ever. I am AR and bloody proud of it. I don't expect others to be (though I'd love if they were obviously). My Boyfriend eats meat and my family bred dogs (till my granny died - it was her hobby).

I know the way the media works and that many will think I am about to dig up their grannies......

It is NOT the case. I respect life end of story and as far as non-human animals are concerned yes, I have a serious problem with putting a price on life, but that is an issue that I will take up with anyone at their discretion. Discuss it yes, when you want to bring it up.

However if and when I am attacked I will defend myself pretty much like little Eve, rattle my tail a bit then bite!

I am a very easygoing person and can discuss anything rationally, but if my personal care of my "babies" is called into question I will basically fight back with all I have. Rescue is the one aspect of my life that I am bloomin proud of and I know I do well.

We are not crazy you know! Ask me any question about being AR and I will give you a straight answer.

Thanks and once again, thanks for all the advice with the snakes!
Cat
PS pics: http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/snake...pics-last.html

Hi Cat
I want to just start by saying I respect you for being honest and some of the things you do for animals.
I have alot of experience with AR people, and in my experience there are different degrees of what they stand for and what they think being a ARA really is.
I have had many years debating with ARA and they have made it clear to me many times that they consider pets as slaves and that anyone who keeps pets ( unless rescued ) are support slavery and are not truely ARA.
They would be classed as AW. So while you may think this is a great website, and it is, animals rights people would not agree, infact the want to ban reptile keeping, and ALL pet keeping.

[Lynne]

Originally Posted by AshMashMash

And thus why you cant really comment. You're saying testing on people is a viable alternative? You nothing about science, how can you say that? Do you know the numbers involved, or the process, or anything at all?

Dont be so rediculous...

i can comment on anything i wish. i made a statement and i stand by that statement. always have and i always will. i know nothing about science, but i do know it was done before. and tbh we dont live in a law abiding society. murders are increasing, as are rapes. parents dont even have the right to ptotect children better by being informed if a child molester is living the that area. i know crime is on the increase, and this could be used as a deterrent. and until you can spell the word, dont tell anyone not to be ridiculas!!!!!

[dragonbreeder]

Originally Posted by dragonbreeder

having read the first post and not seing what provoked it and presuming it was just a random post.
i have come to the conclusion that the OP thought that it would be a touchy subject for a good "debate" which, due to the current state of our hobby with so many against it, has instead turned into an argument.
or, at least, having only read the first and last post
will turn into an argument very soon.

Erik

[Lynne]

Originally Posted by dragonbreeder

its a debate erik. you cant beat a good debate!!!!

[dragonbreeder]

Originally Posted by Lynne

its a debate erik. you cant beat a good debate!!!!

very true Ms. Kyle