The entire reason behind pet shops

[spider_mad]

I think that there should be NVQ qualifications in animal science and animal hubsndry which can be an all round subject on exotic animals not just on reptiles but general husbandry, feeding, geography and bioeconomicsand learning where the given animal comes form and mirroring the requirements in captivity. If courses like that were available pet shops could take on staff who know what they are doing, and there probably are some pet shops out there that need brushing up on their knowledge if animals and not see them as just a sale and need care for it properly in the shop.

[Athravan]

Originally Posted by spider_mad

I think that there should be NVQ qualifications in animal science and animal hubsndry which can be an all round subject on exotic animals not just on reptiles but general husbandry, feeding, geography and bioeconomicsand learning where the given animal comes form and mirroring the requirements in captivity. If courses like that were available pet shops could take on staff who know what they are doing, and there probably are some pet shops out there that need brushing up on their knowledge if animals and not see them as just a sale and need care for it properly in the shop.

That's very true. The Pet Store Management qualification is a bit of a joke if you're a specialist reptile shop.

[sami]

Originally Posted by purejurrasic

You know, i totally agree with the fact a pet shop needs to mark up to survive.

What I dont argree with is employing staff who know diddly squat about the animals they are 'recomending' and the 'sometimes' found practice of trying to sell, push or force customers to buy equipment that is either not needed or simply inncorect for the animal.

This practice can never be agreed with under the banner 'they need to make a profit'

and here you have your problem.

No pet shops make mega-bucks, it's just not a high money/high profit industry.

This means you can't afford to pay the saqturday/sunday help much more than (if more at all) than minimum wage, this means they are not going to be an expert by any stretch of the imagination.

If we were willing to see normal corns sold at £400 each then they could pay staff £20k a year and aim at graduates, breeders and long term herpers to give knowledgeable staff.


As things stand though you get what you pay for, and the wages offered are offered low out of necessity.

Same with the pushing equipment thats not needed or not idea. They may only know what they have been told, or instructed. This includes upselling as many other items (eg sand, fancy ornaments for vivs etc) as that is where a lot of the profit comes from (it's the 'bread and biutter' stuff they sell that keeps them going, not the one or two high end animals they will sell from time to time.


At the end of the day behind every petshop and it's staff there is some poor mug who just like the rest of us has to pay his/her/their mortgage/bills/transport/food etc on top of shop running costs, shop bills, wages, supplier bills etc.


It is *very* rarely a game that makes anyone rich. Must be satisfying as hell if you get one running nicely though, you'll not be rich but I imagine if you got into the game for thye right reasons you'll sure be happy

[spider_mad]

Originally Posted by Athravan

That's very true. The Pet Store Management qualification is a bit of a joke if you're a specialist reptile shop.

Although it isnt surprising how bad some pet shops are managed considering when I was applying to uni and looking for animal science I think there was about 2 courses available in that area. 2 courses in 2 different colleges or unis through the whole of England isnt that great, its not the most sought after course so they dont bother with it but would help in the long run if there were more courses available whether it be NVQ, foundation or diploma.

[purejurrasic]

I agree with a lot of the above, the simple fact that some shop owners are active on this forum goes to show they are indeed caring, interested and sharing types. They are not those whom I refer to.

Its through mediums such as this forum that we all spread the 'word' if you like, and fill that need for specialist knowledge.

I also agree that all to often, the collective 'we' are to fast to jump on the ' lets close pet shops down' bandwagon. They have a part to play in our hobby, a very important part.

I would love to see some kind of classification within the licencing system, ie, dry goods only, certain groups of animals only. And a distinction between cb for pet trade and huge volume wc imports getting into the system.

I agree also that if prices were overall higher, then there would be more money in the pot to improve the situation. Its the 'bulk imports' and supressed prices that we all have to contend with that force market prices down.

I have seen and heard the argument many times, 'if you can sell your cb at the same price as those cf or wc...', thats not the answer. those low prices support nothing but stressed animals and a lack of care. We all need to do our bit and promote the proper care of animals, and if that means a higher price, so be it.

Now, I know that some on this forum have shops, and I have never been there, but if the shops are run with the same manner as you conduct yourselves on here, then I am in no doubt that you have a great shop and care for your animals. Its those who buy stock from wholesale importers as 'units for sale' that dont.

Lets not forget one important thing, these are not cars or washing machines we are talking about, they are living animals, and as such deserve our best attention.

Oh btw, 500th post

[lesvegas]

and a very sensible 500th post

There are good and bad people in every trade but shops play a vital part in the trade by attracting new owners. I would guess that a good 80% first fall in love with an animal in a shop where they can see and touch the animal.

I think licensing laws could be tighter in certain areas and a designated course specializing in herps would benefit the whole industry but i for one will not travel miles to go on expensive pet shop managment courses that wont help at all.

After all there is nothing better than walking into a well stocked super clean shop and choosing a little friend, thats why people will pay the prices and why shouldnt shops charge it

I cant imagine many people starting in this business to exploit animals and get rich because its very rare if possible at all

I personally would never employ anyone unless they could prove their knowledge and if they werent sure about something they would get the correct training from me or my business partner

[purejurrasic]

Originally Posted by lesvegas

I cant imagine many people starting in this business to exploit animals and get rich because its very rare if possible at all

Unfortantly, I do know one or two (not on this forum) that are purely dealers, import under the table, sell on to petshops. trouble is, I doubt the pet shops know in a lot of cases, as these people do make a lot of money, so prices paid are not that much lower than trade.

And yes, they have been reported a number of times, and are being investigated, so I am told !!

[Kellybee]

I genuinely would MUCH rather pay more for a CB animal than less for a WC. My Timorensis is supposedly CB, I have no idea where he came from, who bred him, his DOB, whether his parents were related, nothing.

Given the choice, I'd always buy privately from the breeder directly, or would at least LOVE to see a bit more info given in store re the animals being sold. I know that the wholesaler can blag or make these things up, but thats just me being dolly daydream. Fortunately this kind of info IS available privately quite often....

It's just a personal preference, and I know that most of my animals are in fact WC (6 scorpions, 5 collareds), however I have been into SO many shops where it doesnt state CB or WC, CF whatever, and when you ask, they simply didnt ask the person they bought it from. Beardies are guaranteed CB, but you ask what morphs the parents were? No idea. What's he going to look like in 2 years time? No idea. To the average amateur, they aren't likely to ask these kind of questions or give a rats ass anyway, but SO many people including myself and other not so amateur hobbyists will still go and buy animals from a shop instead of online, nothing wrong in it, but the shops, and the buyers will gain so much more from this kind of service in CB animals.

[dargos mom]

I have a HND in animal management, it means nothing other
than I can read a book and find information about an animal
I have learned far more by looking after and talking to people
who look after animals than ever i did getting a qualification.
So no point in making shop owners take any exam in my humble
opinion, total waste of time.

Also most pet shops dont have the time or space to look after
the animals, or research the animals as well as a potential owner
should. They hope to have a high turn over of animals, as they
dont make their money off them, but off the cages/vivs etc... so they
dont feel the need to give adequate space.

At the end of the day If you are going to buy an animal, then
surely you would have researched that animal first...cant blame
the pet shops for care/prices..if you know what you want, you
know what you are prepared to pay.. Its up to the consumer
to make decisions based on the facts that are in front of them.

[purejurrasic]

If a pet shop does not have the time or space, then they should not be keeping them.

These are not inert bags of sand, or little plastic castles, they are living animals. If a pet shop, or indeed anyone, intends to keep them, no matter for how short or long, to keep as a pet or to sell on, then they MUST ensure they are housed and cared for correctly.

There is NO excuse for anything less.


Like I said before, there ARE pet shops who do care for thier animals, and still stay in business. Those who dont should not be permitted to keep live animals at all.