Thoughts??????

[Cold blooded but prime]

In summer when my igy is out in the garden when she has had enough she walks in the side door into the sitting room through the kitchen up 2 sets of stairs and into the bedroom where her viv is could this be pressumed as her coming home lol?

The viv opens when im home and she comes out and sits on me as I scratch her, and she definatley acts different around certain individuals, she is sooo friendly with me, my sister and my gf yet she wont go anywhere near my mum or brother or grandma and my mum and brother keep reps so its not a nervous thing.

I can see what your saying and I have mixed views but I cant help but think from what I see with my iggy, peoples beardies, and burms that at some stage in life these animals mite become domesticated?

[Cold blooded but prime]

Yea I see what everyone is saying with breeding and most association is to do with food, all very interesting so far.

With regards to snakes yea I agree they wouldnt come home but cats are known to ditch owners too I mean our cat is horribale and so dippy that mite be her flaw as a blonde but I would concider my iguana more domesticated than her lol

[essexchondro]

In summer when my igy is out in the garden when she has had enough she walks in the side door into the sitting room through the kitchen up 2 sets of stairs and into the bedroom where her viv is could this be pressumed as her coming home lol?

The viv opens when im home and she comes out and sits on me as I scratch her, and she definatley acts different around certain individuals, she is sooo friendly with me, my sister and my gf yet she wont go anywhere near my mum or brother or grandma and my mum and brother keep reps so its not a nervous thing.

I can see what your saying and I have mixed views but I cant help but think from what I see with my iggy, peoples beardies, and burms that at some stage in life these animals mite become domesticated?

But it all depends upon your definition of "domesticated". Sure, you could class your iggy as domesticated...but only if you water-down the common-usage definition of what domesticated means so that it fits the behaviour that you're seeing. If you watered down the definition even more you could probably make some distinctions between wild tarantulas and captive bred ones so that you could describe CB tarantulas as domesticated. Water-down some more and you've got domesticated crickets that you're about to feed to domesticated lizards!!

Reptile biology and mental ability is very different to that of relatively intelligent mammals such as cats and dogs. To suppose that reptiles could somehow achieve the same levels of domestication just through being kept as pets - without undergoing quite significant levels of evolutionary change - is a bit unrealistic in my opinion.

[Cold blooded but prime]

lol yea ok see your point!

Originally Posted by essexchondro

But it all depends upon your definition of "domesticated". Sure, you could class your iggy as domesticated...but only if you water-down the common-usage definition of what domesticated means so that it fits the behaviour that you're seeing. If you watered down the definition even more you could probably make some distinctions between wild tarantulas and captive bred ones so that you could describe CB tarantulas as domesticated. Water-down some more and you've got domesticated crickets that you're about to feed to domesticated lizards!!

Reptile biology and mental ability is very different to that of relatively intelligent mammals such as cats and dogs. To suppose that reptiles could somehow achieve the same levels of domestication just through being kept as pets - without undergoing quite significant levels of evolutionary change - is a bit unrealistic in my opinion.

[hephev]

Originally Posted by Athravan

If you take 100 cats, or 100 dogs, and let them loose from their homes, I think a question is how many of them want to return, and will choose to return (jf they can find their way) to their owners. I think the answer is in the majority, most, if they can find their way home, will return home (assuming they've been well treated of course). They choose to live with us. Cats go out every day, some are shut out all night, and the vast majority return to their home the next day, perhaps for food, perhaps for warmth, perhaps they like the companionship, but they recognise humans as providing those things and are not afraid of us, so they come back.

Let a snake out of it's viv and you will never see it again, unless it's by accident and it didn't intend to be seen

That's one of the primary differences I see between reptiles and cats/dogs. I do not think a reptile will ever choose to return to it's owner with any actual thought process.

OMG are you trying to say that my reps don't love me?!?!?!?! How dare you!!!!!!

[Luca Brasi]

Originally Posted by Cold blooded but prime

I wonder if and at what point reptiles will become domesticated pets like cats and dogs I recon snakes like burms and lizards like beardies will be domesticated first and many others to follow. I mean cats and dogs have been kept for a longggggg time in compare I dont know how long reptiles have been kept or if reptiles will ever be domesticated to the same level but you could say some cats and dogs are still wild or maybe they are more feral infact! Anyway I would say my burm is more domesticated than my horribale cat! lol

Domestication (from Latin domesticus) or taming refers to the process whereby a population of animals or plants, through a process of selection, becomes accustomed to human provision and control. The most common form of domestication is artificial selection by humans. ...

That is taken from wikipedia but I wouldnt say a cat is controled to the same level a dog is yet its domesticated, and I would say that since some reptiles are accustome to control and provision can they be termd domesticated? look at beardies for example with handling,walking, feeding etc human interaction!

Wat we think?

It won't ever happen. Simples...

[becky89]

I think maybe as well, animals like cats and dogs are not always solitairy, they do desire companionship, so this may be why we have been able to domesticate them? I can't see us being able to do this with reptiles though, as long as they're getting fed and watered I don't think they're actually that bothered, they don't need companionship!

[Cold blooded but prime]

see I dissagree with this, to an extent. I mean not all reptiles but some I believe do enjoy companionship weather they need it or not is different as you could say a cat doesnt really need companionship and will manage fine on its own and neither do reptiles but cats enjoy companionship as do i believe some reptiles.
so for that reason I think domestication could be possible maybe just at some form of a different level.

Originally Posted by becky89

I think maybe as well, animals like cats and dogs are not always solitairy, they do desire companionship, so this may be why we have been able to domesticate them? I can't see us being able to do this with reptiles though, as long as they're getting fed and watered I don't think they're actually that bothered, they don't need companionship!

[Cold blooded but prime]

How can you say....... it wont ever happen simples lol its not as simple or black and white as that!

Originally Posted by Luca Brasi

It won't ever happen. Simples...

[essexchondro]

see I dissagree with this, to an extent. I mean not all reptiles but some I believe do enjoy companionship weather they need it or not is different as you could say a cat doesnt really need companionship and will manage fine on its own and neither do reptiles but cats enjoy companionship as do i believe some reptiles.
so for that reason I think domestication could be possible maybe just at some form of a different level.

But what evidence can you provide that proves that reptiles "enjoy" human companionship? It's all well and good saying that you believe they enjoy it, but without evidence that could be nothing more than wishful thinking on your part; a case of you "seeing what you want to see". It's human nature to want something that you love to love you back and this kind of anthropomorphism is something that a great many "pet" reptile keepers seem to be guilty of, in my opinion.

Suggesting that "domestication could be possible maybe just at some form of a different level" goes back to the point I made earlier about watering-down the definition of what domestication is. All you're really suggesting is to change the meaning of domestication so that the behaviour you're seeing in reptiles can qualify as domesticated! In other words, you're dragging the meaning of the term down, rather than acknowledging that the behaviour of reptiles should be elevated to the status of "domesticated".