KC or not KC?

[fenwoman]

Originally Posted by ownedbyroxy

I recommended farmers weekly and horse and hound. Plus a gundog website.

Thanks for taking the time to write those tips. Will pass them onto her.
Can i just ask. Do you think some people think that KC means 'sound pups' and that they're the best of the best?

indeed. People think that the kennel club checks pedigrees to make sure they are correct and makes breeders do health tests etc. They consider KC registered to be a benchmark of quality.

if you have say 7 seven pups in a litter, there are always going to be some better than others. But all will be registered.

It depends. When I was showing dogs, some of the pups would be sold as 'show potential' based purely on looks and conformation. They would be more expensive than the pet quality pups. No better than the show potential pups but with a small physical thing which means it would be highly unlikely to win. Say, not enough angulation, or, too wide in front, or colour not right, or tail set too high or too low. Still great healthy pups with good temperament, from sound good temperament parents, but just not good enough to show. Now I no longer show and have no interest in showing. However, if I have a litter of my cavaliers, I find that people have been brainwashed to believe that unless they are KC registered, there is something wrong with them or with the parents, or with me as a breeder regardless that they are bred the same, reared the same, from health tested parent, and all going microchipped, innoculated and insured. So I tend to register, knowing that in most cases, the paperwork will be shoved in a drawer and never see the light of day again and more often than not, not even transfered into the new owner's name.

Another friend had a litter of GSD's about 5 yrs ago. She had 11. All were registered and endorsed and went to loving homes. However a few yrs later she heard on the grapevine that one of them had been bred from despite the endorsements. She approached the owner and gave a lecture and was told that if she lifted the endorsements on the bitch so they could be registered they would let her have a pup half price! (as if it was a pair of faulty shoes)

Sadly, being endorsed does not mean they cannot be bred from. Unscrupulous people will breed anyway and register with the DLRC in order to say that the puppies are 'registered'. The DLRC would not have come about if people weren't so hung up about puppies needing to be registered..

She's very specific who gets one of her pups. She won't let me have one as i have a child under 5 and live on a busy road.
just goes to show i suppose that not everybody is as they seem.

I too turn away many people for similar reasons to your breeder friend. They might be lovely people with lovely kids but I have to tar everyone with the same brush and work on the premise that every parent I see out in town, with small kids, are too indulgent with their children and as a result, the children do not understand about respecting puppies and not grabbing, lifting up, pulling about etc, are representative of modern parents. After all, what mother would tell me, "we would like one of your puppies. I have a 5 year old who is a total little sod and he kicked the neighbours cat and pulled his granny's cat's tail so hard it came off in his hand. I never say no to him and he is spoiled rotten". They all tell me how wonderful their kids are and how kind they are to animals
They might be, but I'm not prepared to take the chance. After all, it won't be me paying the price if I get it wrong will it?

[Pimperella]

Depends what breed I am looking at or for.

CzW and Saarloos are not kc reg but I would want one with FCI papers tho.

Northern Inuit are not KC reg however I know the lines very very well and know which ones (of which there are many) are lines I wouldn't touch with someone elses.

Now my Lab, He's KC reg, came from a very good breeder and had been extermly well bred from Working parents with FTCH in pedigree.
Wanting one that we could do Field TRail work with as guess what, they can't if not KC reg!
Not just that, I wanted one with traceable pedigree that I could see and since his breeder knew what was behind her dogs and raised them well. Thats why we got him.
My working springer is not KC reg, however her working ability is amazing. The police are very interested in having pups off her aswell as HypoAlert dogs. Have no plans to breed her again til 2010/2011 as we intend to keep a pup[, mum is having one, Hypoalert dogs would take any we offered and same with the police.

Simple thing is. If you want a pet, you should still spend the time researching. A poorly bred kc or poorly bred non kc are one and the same. A poorly bred dog.
A well bred non kc or well bred kc are just the same in risk of health and lifespan etc so it's all about the lines and whats behind them.

[ownedbyroxy]

Originally Posted by fenwoman

I too turn away many people for similar reasons to your breeder friend. They might be lovely people with lovely kids but I have to tar everyone with the same brush and work on the premise that every parent I see out in town, with small kids, are too indulgent with their children and as a result, the children do not understand about respecting puppies and not grabbing, lifting up, pulling about etc, are representative of modern parents. After all, what mother would tell me, "we would like one of your puppies. I have a 5 year old who is a total little sod and he kicked the neighbours cat and pulled his granny's cat's tail so hard it came off in his hand. I never say no to him and he is spoiled rotten". They all tell me how wonderful their kids are and how kind they are to animals
They might be, but I'm not prepared to take the chance. After all, it won't be me paying the price if I get it wrong will it?

Sorry but i had to laugh!!! You do sort of build a picture up in your head of the 'modern day' parent don't you?
NO child is perfect. Well except mine.....
I can't count the amount of times i've heard people moaning or rolling their eyes at me cos i've disiplined my child in the supermarket.
I'd much rather that then be bringing up a child to speak obscenities and be foul and impolite and rude or aggressive.


Seriously though, my daughter is good with the animals. She knows to leave dog alone if she is in her bed / in the kitchen. And to leave the skunks alone full stop.
She knows she is not to go near the snake vivs. Or poke her fingers through the birds cages. Or pick the cat up.. So far she's had a few scratches from our cat. i've really drummed it into her that our animals are our family members and they need to have some peace and need lots of love and respect.
She also knows when she goes to grannies she has to leave her cat alone. My mums cat isn't very sociable. A few growls and a scar later - my daughter now knows that she is not aloud to touch her.
Although i've said all this about my daughter, she is still young. And ahe does sometimes forget and think that the cat needs to be snuggled in his bed etc. So i completely understand my friends terms on rehoming pups. End of the day, they are her pups and she must seek the best homes possible and be 1000% happy with the new families.

I think children and animals can live well together. But the child needs to respect the animal.