Im Really Annoyed

[Drummerkid]

a woman got in touch with me, trying to sell her tortoise to me.

have a look at this conversation i had with her.

From:
To: jasonrodgers787@hotmail.com
Subject:
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:10:09 +0000

.Hi, i have a 4 year old female horsefield tortoise comes with tank and everything inside.£225 ono. We bought her last year as a christmas present for my brother and now he has a puppy and has lost interest. Very healthy comes with some food(pellets) and some powder to put on top of the fresh food as well. If you have any questions email me:horseseva@hotmail.co.uk
if your interested i will try and send some pictures over. We are situated in doncaster.
thanks laura




From: jasonrodgers787@hotmail.com
To:
Subject: RE:
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:59:20 +0000

.Cheers for the e-mail but sorry, im not interested because of the high price and the fact it is being kept in a tank and fed pellets. I am, however, prepared to rescue this tortoise but i simply don't have that kind of money. Please sell this tortoise to a good home or give her to a good home because at the moment she isnt being looked after correctly. Are you willing to give away for free? (im guessing not)



From:
To: jasonrodgers787@hotmail.com
Subject: RE:
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:40:10 +0000
hi we are doing as we were told by the pet shop when we bought her she feeds on pellets and fresh food but OBVIOUSLEY we cannot sell he with the fresh food. she is a well looked after tortoise and the price is not at all high. thanks



From: jasonrodgers787@hotmail.com
To:
Subject: RE:
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:10:27 +0000
tortoises should not be fed pellets, AT ALL. And they should not be kept in tanks. I bet you got this tortoise from a pet shop thats why you looking after it wrong. the diet should be an 100% weed diet. no fuit no veg and certainly no pellets. and yes £225 is high. i know breeders that sell horsfields for £140 and they're are proberly more healthy than yours. But don't worry you're not alone. this happens to hundreds to people. They buy from a pet shop and are given wrong advise. Please remember pet shops are businness and they only care about a quick profit and not the health of there animals (there are some good ones out there put they are pretty rare)
If you do not beleive me please read this..



It is worth commenting upon the canned (usually dried) 'complete tortoise diets' that are available in pet stores. These are advertized as complete, or almost complete, solutions to all of your tortoise nutrition concerns. Words such as 'scientifically formulated' and 'quality ingredients' are used to describe them. You may think you are safe relying upon such products. We have tested most of these products over the years, and in our view, they should be avoided. We have also seen numerous 'dietary disasters' attributable to their use. These products are usually extremely high in protein, and many contain high sugar levels in addition. They in no way approximate the natural diet of these animals. Rather than describe each one in detail, we will let the following pictures speak for themselves. These two animals, a Terrapene carolina (American box turtle) and a young Geochelone sulcata (African Spurred tortoise) were both raised from juveniles using T-Rex brand 'complete' tortoise and turtle pellet food.

Note the severe deformity at the rear of the carapace: a condition typical of animals raised on high protein, high growth rates and inadequate levels of calcium.

Mediterranean tortoises fed on cat or dog food, or other high protein food items such as peas or beans, frequently die from renal failure or from impacted bladder stones of solidified urates. Peas and beans are also very high in phytic acid, which, like oxalic acid, inhibits calcium uptake. Avoid reliance upon ‘supermarket’ greens and fruits which typically contain inadequate fiber levels, excessive pesticide residues, and are too rich in sugar. Fruit should be given very sparingly or not at all as it frequently leads to diarrhea, intestinal parasite proliferation, and colic. We do not use fruit at all with our Mediterranean tortoises and we suggest you do the same. Unfortunately, it is all-too-common to see totally inappropriate and dangerous advice on feeding these species. This example is from a veterinary website:
Tortoises (Testudo sp) eat a wide variety of plants including vegetables, fruits, grasses and flowers : alfalfa leaves, apples, banana, beans (runner and french), bean sprouts, bindweed, blackberries, broccoli, Brussel sprouts, buttercup, cabbage, carrot, cauliflower, chickweed, clover, courgettes, cucumber, dandelion, grass, hawkweed, lettuce, melon, nectarines, parsnips, peaches, pears, peas, plums, raspberries, strawberries, tomatoes, watercress. They can also be given hard boiled eggs or a spoon of canned pet food once a week.”
This is a truly appalling diet for Mediterranean tortoises. It is heavily biased towards root vegetables and fruit (both of which cause major gastric disturbance in these species), it includes peas and beans which are far too high in protein, have a terrible calcium to phosphorous ratio and are rich in calcium inhibiting compounds. It also includes cabbage family leaves to excess, and finishes up with meat and boiled eggs, neither of which I have seen lying around in any Mediterranean tortoise habitat I have yet visited… A tortoise on pellets.


also read this very usefull link.

A Habitat for Horsfields











From:
To: jasonrodgers787@hotmail.com
Subject: RE:
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:21:51 +0000

.breeders do not sell them with the vivarium! that maybe is why there is a price difference!so £225 is not high and you must not be very well off to think so. thanks for the advice but she doesn't look oval shaped to me and she has managed a good 4 years being fed this stuff so obviously it isn't that bad for them.
Laura!



From: jasonrodgers787@hotmail.com
To:
Subject: RE:
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:17:46 +0000

THATS THE POINT
VIVS ARE BAD - VIVS ARE BAD - VIVS ARE BAD
and if a breeder tried to sell me one i would run for the hills
i'll give this tortoise enough 4-6 years before it dies of kidney failure or another sort of disease.
you do not wish to listen to me, so let her die.

[Drummerkid]

im very annoyed that this person thinks that pellets and vivs are not bad just because its lived 4 years!

[Drummerkid]

shes just sent me a reply!

check this out.....!

i have read in books that their basic diet is fruit so i doubt that she will die. i dont know where you have found your information but fruit is clearly stated that that is their diet in the wild. of course you dont want to change their natural diet do you?couldnt that cause some confusion in their bodies?

[Tops]

make sure you publish her details all over the place too so any psychos from the shelled section can get in touch with her

[Andy b 1]

has she got msn?

[Tomcat]

Hi, just ignore her. You have advised, and she is being ignorant. She doesnt care, her brother doesnt care, the tortoise isnt looked after properly. Ask her to send you a piccie of it. Also, when i was looking at hermans and horsefields, 100-125 was the average price, so yes, she is high. But as she said, it comes with a viv, so thats the expensive bit. Ask her if it has got all of the lights needed, and if they got changed every 6 months.

[Tomcat]

Originally Posted by Andy b 1

has she got msn?

Yeah, hotmail. It says her email address too.

[Fangio]

Originally Posted by Tops

make sure you publish her details all over the place too so any psychos from the shelled section can get in touch with her

[wizzasmum]

Sadly this is the first of many such mails you will receive from people like this. All you can do is point them in the right direction and hope for the best. After many years of rehabbing it's no surprise and is the reason why so many torts are imported each year. Think about it, to justify so many imports a high percentage of them MUST die. Something that is capable of living 100 years just would not be imported in such vast numbers if they survived even the first few years
ps my torts are much less than £140

[Drummerkid]

Originally Posted by Tomcat

Hi, just ignore her. You have advised, and she is being ignorant. She doesnt care, her brother doesnt care, the tortoise isnt looked after properly. Ask her to send you a piccie of it. Also, when i was looking at hermans and horsefields, 100-125 was the average price, so yes, she is high. But as she said, it comes with a viv, so thats the expensive bit. Ask her if it has got all of the lights needed, and if they got changed every 6 months.

im just trying to help the tortoise, i dont thin she is ignorant. just un-educated. I will not rest until this tortoise is being looked after coreectly!