I now hate RUBS (Really Useful Boxes)

[StevetheSnake]

People mouthing off about stuff they don't have a clue about again, this place is getting worse. Do you think a snake cares about the aesthetics of its housing? As long as it has ample heat/water/humidity/hides (delete as appropriate) they are happy. I have four snakes in RUBs and they all eat/shed/poop perfectly are in perfect health. Get off your soap box.

[GothGirl]

What annoys me is the lack of space, lack of enrichment etc.

Yes I use RUBs or similar for quarantine, but even the largest RUB is too small for some snake breeds.

I always have hides and enrichment etc, not just a box and a bowl.

[Moshpitviper]

Originally Posted by GothGirl

Yes they're useful, but its the pricks that come with them.

I think they've done more damage to the hobby than good.

I'm not saying everyone with a RUB or a Rack is a nob but It's the people with RUBS or racks etc. that decide because this small box is so useful, that is all they need.

A life confined in a box with nothing but a water bowl.....is not a life.

Just Google and these kind of images come up
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I honestly think its images like these, and the keepers who believe in these methods, are a lot of fuel to the fires of people against reptile keeping.

I feel sorry for the animals that live their life like that.

* I am using RUB as a generalisation for plastic storage boxes, not just Really Useful boxes are aimed at in this thread

Wind your neck in poppet.

[9Red]

I think it serves to illustrate how poor some people's understanding of reptile psychology and their cognitive capacity really is. As has been said, snakes do not need or desire extensive setups with elaborate environmental enrichment in order to experience an optimal state of welfare. They are not intelligent in the way many mammals or birds are - they do not sit in their enclosures thinking 'I wish I had a plant to sniff at or a cork bark hide instead of this cardboard box'. Snakes have very simple brains with a primative understanding of the world around them, indeed the limits of their cognative functions can be summed up as 'I'm too hot/cold, I'm hungry/thirsty, I want to mate with something' and 'I need a poo'.

Personally I keep animals in vivs and in RUBS, all with hides and some form of decor, usually a branch or plastic plant, but I do that more because I already had the decor available and it's more visually appealing to us than for the animals' welfare. For example, my adult male royal is housed in a gorgeous viv with extensive decor, but he ignores it completely and spends 99% of his time in his hide with his face poking out waiting for the next meal to arrive.

I can understand why the OP believes the use of RUB setups adds fuel to the fire with the anti-reptile brigade, but lets not forget what an ill-informed racket they are, with a talent for creating problems where there aren't any because their understanding of our husbandry systems is so poor. If you want to be able to evaluate animal welfare objectively you cannot be anthropomorphic about it.

[Rain]

Originally Posted by GothGirl

Rain, this I could deal with, it has some space though no hides are provded, which wouldn't hurt....
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This imo is out of order.....
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And most of these aren't royals, and not a hide in site, again big snake small box.
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And I 100% agree. There is nothing wrong with using appropriate RUBs/Boxes. That's the key word. Appropriate.
If the snake is stressed, it needs a hide, if it's squashed, it needs a bigger box. It's basic care no different to knowing that a ATB needs more than 6inches of height, or that a hognose needs something to burrow in.

[GothGirl]

Originally Posted by StevetheSnake

People mouthing off about stuff they don't have a clue about again, this place is getting worse. Do you think a snake cares about the aesthetics if its housing? As long as it has ample heat/water/humidity/hides (delete as appropriate) they are happy. I have four snakes in RUBs and they all eat/shed/poop perfectly are in perfect health. Get off your soap box.

That's what I'm talking about... boxes like in the pictures with no hides and no space etc.

Rubs are useful, if you kit them out properly for the snake and get one big enough.

[missy_moo]

I dont like RUBS either, most not ALL of the ones ove seen are just a water bowl nothing else what kind if a life is this?
My boas love there viv with lots of logs and plants to climb and hide it,no doubt in a rub they would be bored sh!tless.
And yes it may be easier for people to have them in rubs so they can save on space but why should the animal have less space just so the owner can have more snakes?

[Owzy]

Don't hate.... love and change

Peace to all.

[kieran8143]

Originally Posted by Moshpitviper

Wind your neck in poppet.

[GothGirl]

Originally Posted by Rain

And I 100% agree. There is nothing wrong with using appropriate RUBs/Boxes. That's the key word. Appropriate.
If the snake is stressed, it needs a hide, if it's squashed, it needs a bigger box. It's basic care no different to knowing that a ATB needs more than 6inches of height, or that a hognose needs something to burrow in.

That is EXACTLY what I am trying to say.

Its the people that use RUBs as an excuse to give their snake nothing else, no hides no enrichment etc.

After all a vivarium is just a box too, its what you put in side it that counts.