holothele incei

[Peacemaker1987]

Hey guys, can someone give me some information on these guys? Very interested in them...seen one on the virginiacheeseman but don't really know anything about them.
I would be interested in having a communal setup with these guys...so if anyone could tell me about them that would be great. Also if you do a commune with these guys do they have to be from the same sack or can you use T's from another genetic line?
Also, how common are they over here...because i hardly ever see them on the classifieds or anything.
Cheers guys.

[Peacemaker1987]

...anyone?

[ph0bia]

Yeah, I got one of these from her recently too.

Standard terrestrial set-up, kept dry with a water dish (or mist the webbing in case of slings). Don't even worry about a hide, just plenty of anchor points for the webbing. They will web the enclosure up completely, making their own webbed hide.

For communal, they'd need to be from the same sack, and they need a larger enclosure. It's like keeping Emperor Scorpions communally. However, all communal projects eventually end in cannibalisation, it's just a matter of when, so be certain you don't mind losing some before you try

[GRB]

Originally Posted by ph0bia

For communal, they'd need to be from the same sack, and they need a larger enclosure. It's like keeping Emperor Scorpions communally. However, all communal projects eventually end in cannibalisation, it's just a matter of when, so be certain you don't mind losing some before you try

There is a thread on the ATS boards about a very large, multigenerational set up with around 200 individuals which has been set up to investigate inbreeding in spiders. Besides limited predation between nest mates, there appears to be very low rates of cannabalism, considering they are quite densely populated.

[Peacemaker1987]

Originally Posted by GRB

There is a thread on the ATS boards about a very large, multigenerational set up with around 200 individuals which has been set up to investigate inbreeding in spiders. Besides limited predation between nest mates, there appears to be very low rates of cannabalism, considering they are quite densely populated.

Hence why i want to have a commune of h.incei...however i can't seem to find any in great numbers...does anyone know of anyone selling any excluding the one that virginiacheeseman has?

[GRB]

Originally Posted by Peacemaker1987

Hence why i want to have a commune of h.incei...however i can't seem to find any in great numbers...does anyone know of anyone selling any excluding the one that virginiacheeseman has?

Indeed, I was correcting phobia's earlier comment - I think most people that keep these have large communes, at least in the US anyway. I think you would have more success searching in Europe, as stocks of these never seem to reach the UK in appreciable numbers.

[ph0bia]

Originally Posted by GRB

There is a thread on the ATS boards about a very large, multigenerational set up with around 200 individuals which has been set up to investigate inbreeding in spiders. Besides limited predation between nest mates, there appears to be very low rates of cannabalism, considering they are quite densely populated.

Oh, of course, it's lower than most other species, but my point is it's still there.

[GRB]

Originally Posted by ph0bia

For communal, they'd need to be from the same sack, and they need a larger enclosure. It's like keeping Emperor Scorpions communally. However, all communal projects eventually end in cannibalisation, it's just a matter of when, so be certain you don't mind losing some before you try

My point was that you said all communal projects end in cannibalism. With H.incei they dont; the ATS example is from a community of extremely large numbers and high population density. If someone kept half that number in the same size of vivarium I'd expect to see cannibalism lower still, and keeping 4-6 in a reasonable sized viv would likely eliminate it altogether. By reasonable, I'd expect a 45cm exo terra to hold this number comfortably.

Cannibalism between egg sac members or weak early instars is not the same as cannibalism found in other species, where you will often lose adult specimens or juve's. Incidentally, I also keep Damon diadema communally without anything so much as a fight. There's a growing body of evidence for certain arachnids to be more sociable than thought, and semi-socialitly exists across several orders within the Arachnida, so it's more widespread than previously thought.

[Peacemaker1987]

Originally Posted by GRB

My point was that you said all communal projects end in cannibalism. With H.incei they dont; the ATS example is from a community of extremely large numbers and high population density. If someone kept half that number in the same size of vivarium I'd expect to see cannibalism lower still, and keeping 4-6 in a reasonable sized viv would likely eliminate it altogether. By reasonable, I'd expect a 45cm exo terra to hold this number comfortably.

Cannibalism between egg sac members or weak early instars is not the same as cannibalism found in other species, where you will often lose adult specimens or juve's. Incidentally, I also keep Damon diadema communally without anything so much as a fight. There's a growing body of evidence for certain arachnids to be more sociable than thought, and semi-socialitly exists across several orders within the Arachnida, so it's more widespread than previously thought.

I am thinking when i have the money that i am going to get 10 slings from Sven Koppler. Would you recommend putting straight in a large tank, or move them from small to progressively larger like any other single tarantula?
I am very much looking forward to getting these guys!

[emilyloulou]

out of interest does sven have a current list up anywhere?

Emily