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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 05-05-2008, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fat-pat View Post
also what about het Leucistic royals
There are no normal-looking royals that are het leucisitic.

Here is a thread on making a blue-eyed leucistic:

Kingsnake.com - Herpforum - How to make Blue eyed lucy
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 06-05-2008, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulh View Post
There are no normal-looking royals that are het leucisitic.

Here is a thread on making a blue-eyed leucistic:

Kingsnake.com - Herpforum - How to make Blue eyed lucy
Welll.... there sort of is a normal-looking allele on the "white snake" locus that is made up of Russo Lemon Line, Mojave, Lesser, Butter, Mocha and Phantom ... the "mystery/dilute" gene that turns a Lesser Platinum into a Platinum, creates the Phantom44 out of Phantoms and probably results in the Crystal ball when combined with Mojave. It's not quite Blue-Eyed Leucistic producing... but then neither is a Super Mojave a real blue-eyed leucy.

Now, what a homozygous Mystery-Dilute looks like is anyone's guess.
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Lizards: 2.2 E. macularius, 1.2 H. caudicinctus, 1.0 R. ciliatus, 0.2.1 A. fragilis, 1.1 T. merianae, 1.0 V. niloticus ittibittius
Colubrids: 3.4 P. guttattus, 1.0 P. guttatus X E. climacophora, 1.0 P. o. rossalini, 1.0 P. o. lindheimeri, 0.1 E. anomala
1.2 Lamprophis spp, 1.0 L. g. nigritus, 0.1 L. g. californiae, 1.0 H. n. nasicus
Boids: 1.1 E. c. maurus, 0.1 E. conicus, 4.1 P. regius, 1.1 A. maculosa
We HAD a three-bedroom house... Current lodgers: 1.0 E. c. maurus, 1.1 E. c. loveridgei, 0.1 E. macularius, 1.0 L. t. annulata
Snakes'n'Adders turned my girls into boys - thanks for showing us how to probe.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 12:43 PM
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This might help.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 01:01 PM
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this is a better one!
Markus Jayne, Ball pythons | ballpython.ca
lucys are dom! wich means that you need two co-dom to make one,
wich one aswell? blue or black eyed? blue eyed (wich i think look nicer) would come from two mojaves breeding. black eyed come from two fire balls I think, have to check that.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 01:10 PM
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yea was right.
the only two wight snakes that will have het would be the snow and the ivery.
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuggett5 View Post
this is a better one!
Markus Jayne, Ball pythons | ballpython.ca
lucys are dom! wich means that you need two co-dom to make one,
wich one aswell? blue or black eyed? blue eyed (wich i think look nicer) would come from two mojaves breeding. black eyed come from two fire balls I think, have to check that.
Leucistic is not "dominant" - it's just carrying two mutant (non-normal) genes on one of the three "White snake" loci.

Locus 1 is the most complex - it's got multiple "flavours" (alleles) that can be combined to produce various effects. You get Blue Eyed Leucistics by combining any two of the following:
Mojave / Lesser Platinum / Butter / Mocha / Phantom / Vin Russo Lemon Line / Vanilla(?)
A combination of these will be het for each of the two genes it inherited - one from each parent - but they still combine to produce the Leucistic look. Sort of like slightly different flavours of the same food.
You can also get homozygous animals of each of these genes which are generally pale snakes, although not all of them are white snakes with blue eyes. A homozygous mojave isn't a BluEL for example - it's got markings on its head. A homozygous Phantom is a silvery, pale snake with markings. A homozygous Lesser is a true BluEL.

Locus 2 is the Fire/BlkEL locus. You get Black Eyed Leucistics by breeding two Fire royals - a BlkEL is homozygous Fire. But Fire is still a codominant gene.

Locus 3 is the Yellowbelly/Ivory locus. You get Ivory by breeding two Yellowbelly royals - an Ivory is homozygous Yellowbelly. But Yellowbelly is still a codominant gene.

Homozygous does not equal dominant - it just means that the two genes of the pair are the same.

Dominant does not equal homozygous - it just means that an animal with one copy of the gene looks exactly the same as and is indistinguishable from an animal with two copies of the gene - only having no copies looks different.

If a two-copies-of-the-exact-same-gene-allele animal looks different to a one-copy animal, the description of a two-copy animal is "homozygous codominant" or - in herper slang, "super".

And a Blue-eyed Leucistic made using, say, Lesser and Mojave, is NOT a "Super Mojave" or a "Super Lesser" - it is a Lesser Mojave.
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Lizards: 2.2 E. macularius, 1.2 H. caudicinctus, 1.0 R. ciliatus, 0.2.1 A. fragilis, 1.1 T. merianae, 1.0 V. niloticus ittibittius
Colubrids: 3.4 P. guttattus, 1.0 P. guttatus X E. climacophora, 1.0 P. o. rossalini, 1.0 P. o. lindheimeri, 0.1 E. anomala
1.2 Lamprophis spp, 1.0 L. g. nigritus, 0.1 L. g. californiae, 1.0 H. n. nasicus
Boids: 1.1 E. c. maurus, 0.1 E. conicus, 4.1 P. regius, 1.1 A. maculosa
We HAD a three-bedroom house... Current lodgers: 1.0 E. c. maurus, 1.1 E. c. loveridgei, 0.1 E. macularius, 1.0 L. t. annulata
Snakes'n'Adders turned my girls into boys - thanks for showing us how to probe.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ssthisto View Post
Leucistic is not "dominant" - it's just carrying two mutant (non-normal) genes on one of the three "White snake" loci.

Locus 1 is the most complex - it's got multiple "flavours" (alleles) that can be combined to produce various effects. You get Blue Eyed Leucistics by combining any two of the following:
Mojave / Lesser Platinum / Butter / Mocha / Phantom / Vin Russo Lemon Line / Vanilla(?)
A combination of these will be het for each of the two genes it inherited - one from each parent - but they still combine to produce the Leucistic look. Sort of like slightly different flavours of the same food.
You can also get homozygous animals of each of these genes which are generally pale snakes, although not all of them are white snakes with blue eyes. A homozygous mojave isn't a BluEL for example - it's got markings on its head. A homozygous Phantom is a silvery, pale snake with markings. A homozygous Lesser is a true BluEL.

Locus 2 is the Fire/BlkEL locus. You get Black Eyed Leucistics by breeding two Fire royals - a BlkEL is homozygous Fire. But Fire is still a codominant gene.

Locus 3 is the Yellowbelly/Ivory locus. You get Ivory by breeding two Yellowbelly royals - an Ivory is homozygous Yellowbelly. But Yellowbelly is still a codominant gene.

Homozygous does not equal dominant - it just means that the two genes of the pair are the same.

Dominant does not equal homozygous - it just means that an animal with one copy of the gene looks exactly the same as and is indistinguishable from an animal with two copies of the gene - only having no copies looks different.

If a two-copies-of-the-exact-same-gene-allele animal looks different to a one-copy animal, the description of a two-copy animal is "homozygous codominant" or - in herper slang, "super".

And a Blue-eyed Leucistic made using, say, Lesser and Mojave, is NOT a "Super Mojave" or a "Super Lesser" - it is a Lesser Mojave.
Thats a bit hard. I Know someone who bred one from 2 mojaves? your right about the lesser x mojave lol. kev from n.e.r.d must be rong aswell, as it is in hes book as well that 2 mojaves can projuce a blue eyed lucy. but what do i know? I neaver sed they were equal, there two diffrent types of gene! so would not say that. dude before you get sherty check your info and read what other people have writ.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 04:00 PM
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Mojave ball pythons at Australian Addiction Reptiles
there you go!
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 07-05-2008, 04:03 PM
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Graziani Reptiles | ball pythons | grazianireptiles.com
and there!
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Old 07-05-2008, 04:28 PM
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It's not just a case of them making Blue Eyed Leucistics, Mojave x Mojave can produce Leucistics, but most of the time they tend to make the Super Mojave, which has a pale grey head and a mirky white colour.

After alot of extensive research on all the possible combinations/outcomes, I've come to the conclusion that the Vin Russo line of "Het Leucistics" will give the best looking Blue Eyed Leucistics as an outcome, these are often referred to as the "White Diamond"
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Last edited by Akua_Ko_Nalu : 07-05-2008 at 04:33 PM.
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