Finally posting in the correct forum (I think!) Would appreciate any help with the below questions
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
After much scratching of heads, for our second (and third!) snakes, we're going to stick to Kings - ideally Mexican Blacks (H says they look 'polished' lol).

H (Harrison) loves handling our Cali king, it's easy to look after and the kings are stunning snakes to look after - so why fix what isn't broken?? Other snakes can come when he (we!!) are more experienced. Plus, if I can get a pair, there is a breeding potential (I hope!)

So, this weekend looks like I'm raiding B&Q and swearing a lot in my folks garage!!

Planning on making a stack type set up, but would be grateful if you guys would comment/advise on it (before I attempt it!!)

Top viv is going to be 48(L)x18(h)x24(d) (for our current snake) with the bottom stack being split into two (24x18x24) (for the new additions). Going to put a false glass bottom in each stack, for ease of cleaning and to place the heat mats under - can anyone see any problems with this?

Planning to run the top stack on one stat and the bottom stack (2 separate heat mats) on one stat - is this possible, and any recommendations?

Still a bit undecided on lighting, what are peoples thoughts? Is UV necessary/beneficial?? The stack will be situated in an alcove so wont receive much natural daylight. Was considering a fluorescent strip light for the top viv and a low wattage bulb in each of the bottom vivs, any thoughts?? Would having heat lamps as well be better??

How is it best to make the vivs 'escape-proof'?

What are peoples ideas regarding substrate? On bark at the mo, but was thinking of astroturf? These will be display vivs, so dont really want to use paper towels (i dont mind the extra cleaning!)

Lastly, decor - any suggestions?? Apart from the hides, would kings use branches etc??

Anything I've forgotten?? (and apologies for the length of this post!)

Thanks again, and can I just say I've been really impressed with the advice given to the previous (dumb! ) questions I've posted so far

not made a viv before but one thing i can say is don't use one thrmostat for 2 heat mats. the one that does not have the sensor could heat up at a quicker rate than the other and mean it gets to hot for the snake. this could also mean that one mat doesn't get hot enough when the stat switches the mat with the sensor off resulting in an environment that is too cold for the snake. have you considered a twi stat. they have 2 sensors and two temperature dials.
i don't know about astro turf but have considered it myself. literally to save me my huge bill on chippings. be interesting to see what others suggest.

__________________
My Reptiles and inverts1.1 Pantherophis Guttata Guttata0.1 Pituophis melanoleucus sayi1.1 Boa constrictor imperator1.0 Eunectes murinus1.0 Python Regius1.1 Python molurus bivittatus1.1 Python curtus brongermai1.0 Morelia amethistina1.0 Python sebae0.0.1 Bitis Arietans0.1 Atheris chlorechis1.1 Atheris Ceratophora0.0.1 Cryptolytrops Albolabris

I'd use perspex instead of glass for the false floors - heat mats have been known to cause glass to crack.

Your idea regarding stats sounds fine - it's only when using one stat to control vivs on different levels/different sized vivs that you'd get problems. Obviously the heat source for each viv should be identical if used on the same stat.

Lighting - snakes don't need UV at all - it can even be harmful to their eyes in some cases, as can very bright bulbs. Just low wattage bulbs (12w "nightlight" bulbs are good) would be fine.
It would be better to heat the larger viv with a ceramic on a pulse prop stat, unless your house is really warm all year round.

Assuming your making vivs with sliding glass doors the only escape routes would be where the glass overlaps and the vents. With the vents, either use moulded louvre vents with built in mesh, or cover the vents from the back with fine mesh, eg. 6mm galvanised mesh that you can get in sheets from garden centres (you can also make bulb guards out of this stuff).
For the glass overlap I wedge a section of hardboard or cardboard in the gap so that it's filled top to bottom - this also acts as a wedge to stop the doors being pushed open.

I wouldn't bother with astrotruf - you'd have to remove and wash it pretty much every week and have spares for while it's drying. However it does have the advantage of being totally safe for feeding in the viv.
I use beech chip for most of mine - looks nice, easy to spot clean, and for feeding I just lay the food on a large sheet of newspaper.

Other decor - something i've done with a couple of vivs (rat snake and a milk snake) is to have a 12"x12" shelf (with a length of plastic vine fixed around the edge so they can grip) at the cool end, about halfway up. Both snakes use them a lot - it's good excercise for them climbing up and down, and also provides a place to easily lean a climbing branch without having to fix it to the side of the viv.

The only thing I'd do differently is not build it as a stack - I'd build the levels separate, so 2x 48"x24" vivs.
A 4x3x2 viv unit is going to weigh a ton and if they're separate it'll be more versatile if you wanted to re-arrange things at a later date.

I think that's it

Thanks guys, much appreciated.

Can you see any problems with the Viv being 24" deep, yet most heatmats only being 11"? Should I just go a bit wider and make sure I cover 1/3 of the floor area?

I'd not consider ceramics, but been looking about today and the recommendation seems to be a 250w bulb for a 48x24x24, that seem ok (for a 48x18x24)?

Am I right in thinking that I should still use a heatmat (to aid digestion) as well as the ceramic? And should it be on the same side as the ceramic?

And lastly (for now!) whats the best way to fit the ceramic? Vertically from the roof, or diagonally from the side? And is it best to use a reflector?

Thanks for your help again!

Jason

No problem with the viv being 24" deep - use a 23x11 mat across the viv (back to front) near one end. This'll give a warm spot over 1/4 of the floor which will be plenty big enough for a kingsnake. If you wanted a larger warm area you could use a 23x6 mat next to the first mat.
You could also put a 25w bulb in there safely without any control which would warm the air a bit, maybe even a 40w in cooler weather - as long as it's only heating the air to a few degrees above room temp it'll be ok.
(The smaller vivs would be 25w max. without a dimmer stat.)

I go for a ceramic though - a 150w should be plenty for a 48" viv - I've used a 100w in a 3x2x2 viv and got a hot spot of 90f no problem, so 150w should be more than enough even if your house gets cold.

I have my ceramics fixed directly to the viv ceiling (so mounted vertically) using these:
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Search.aspx?...12m6&source=15

They're cheaper and more compact than the hanging type, which you don't have much room for in a 18" high viv anyway. I've only used these fittings with melamine-faced chipboard ("contiboard") which copes fine with the heat - not sure how other types of wood may be affected though.

You don't need a reflector but a guard is a must (for any type of bulb) - you need to have about 2" clearance between the face of the ceramic and the bottom of the guard, and about 1" minimum around the sides. You'd also need to use heat resisitant mains cable - you can get it from electrical trade supplies shops for about £1 per metre.

You could use a heatmat as well as the ceramic (both would be at the same end of the viv) - have the ceramic on during the day and the mat on at night. Not 100% necessary to use both IMO but it wouldn't do any harm and it'd be cheaper than running the ceramic 24/7, and would also give a more natural day/night temp difference while keeping a night time warm spot.

Thanks for all your help Mark, giving me loads to think about!! Just been looking at the microclimate site for stats n mats lol, and came across the AHS system? Any good?

For simplicity would have preferred the heat mat option, but want to get it as right as I can - hence the questions!!

Thanks again

I use both Habistat and Microclimate stats and they both do the job fine, my habistats are maybe a tiny bit more accurate than the microclimates but nothing to worry about. The B2 Pulse Prop.stat would be the best for a ceramic.
This is the cheapest place I know of for Microclimate stats, if you're still looking around:

http://www.camzoo.co.uk/pi456430420.htm?categoryId=12

Never used an AHS - heard mixed things about them. I'd stick with normal ceramics as they've been tried and tested for years.

When you think about all the messing around with false floors, etc for mats it's about the same amount of work as fitting a ceramic really!

Yeah, I think you're right. Altho I think I'm gonna have to heat mat the bottom vivs, so i'll probably heat mat the top one as well as a heating aid.

I really need to stack at the moment due to space.It's going to be a bit of a pain tho, because my plan is to put the adult cali in the 4 foot viv, and a pair of mexican youngsters in the bottom (split) vivs. Then, when they're grown on, open up the bottom viv into another 4 ft viv, (then build another one lol!). which means the bottom viv will probably have to stay heat matted

Thanks for the camzoo/maplins links, miles cheaper than anywhere else I've been looking. Don't suppose I can be cheeky and ask if you can recommend any brands/sites of ceramics or guards? Found one site - Reptiheat direct, any experience of their products?

Thanks again,

Jason

ive always used ceramics with all my snakes and lizards and use a pulse stat for the controllability. i just have settings for day and night but there are stats avaliable now with the day night settings on them

The Reptiheat ones look like the Exo-Terra ceramics, which some people have had fail on them quite quickly. I've got a couple of them and mine have been ok, but I prefer the Pearlco ones - link:

http://www.livefoods.co.uk/product_i...roducts_id=132

They're more expensive but they're smaller and neater, and some people have had them lasting 10 years or more, so worth the extra cost.
I reckon you'd get a decent hotspot with just 100w - it's not like you've got to heat the whole viv, just one end.

Guards - the trouble with shop bought guards is that they're made for use with the hanging ceramic fitting so they're really long, but the normal bulb ones are often too short/narrow.
If you use a maplin fitting (fitting plus pearlco ceramic is about 4.5"), you need a guard ideally about 7" long and about 5" wide.
You may get away with one of these for a maplin/pearlco setup:

http://www.livefoods.co.uk/product_i...roducts_id=519

I've never actually seen one so can't say for sure - it may be a bit small.


I make my own from 6mm galvanised mesh that you can get from garden centres (B&Q and Homebase) for about £4 a sheet. You can get 2 guards from 1 sheet.
Just cut out a suitable shape that you can fold into a box shape with a bottom - like an "L" shape with a thicker vertical bit and a shorter horizontal bit (if you get what I mean ). Then fold out a lip around the top so it can be screwed to the ceiling. You can fasten it together with cable ties, but I "sew" mine together with thin copper wire which makes it really sturdy once screwed in place. You could also solder it together.
This is the kind of thing you'd be looking to end up with:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/vivarium-BULB-...QQcmdZViewItem