Most reptiles arrive in the UK via Germany?

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um... it has? :\

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Beasties1.0 Pony - Seamus1.0 BCI - Alcatraz0.1 Brachypelma Smithi - Muse0.1 Thrixopelma Pruriens - Belle0.0.1 Nhandu Chromatus - Digger0.0.1 Avicularia sp "Peru Purple" - Bramble0.0.15 Peruphasma Schultei ova0.0.3 Pandinus Imperator

Most reptiles arrive from wholesalers in Africa/Indonesia actually, and then the next majorty is probably CB in the UK. After that I would say that the states provides more than germany does

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No internet at home for a few weeks, may take a while to respond. Should be back to normal in Sept.

so "most" reptiles in the uk are imports from Africa/Indonesia?
That i did not know
I thought most would be CB... i figured- one imported pair = loads of CB(uk) babies.


I like how they started the article stating that the sellers were "wildlife dealers".

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Beasties1.0 Pony - Seamus1.0 BCI - Alcatraz0.1 Brachypelma Smithi - Muse0.1 Thrixopelma Pruriens - Belle0.0.1 Nhandu Chromatus - Digger0.0.1 Avicularia sp "Peru Purple" - Bramble0.0.15 Peruphasma Schultei ova0.0.3 Pandinus Imperator

What we should do is...everyone on the forum that bought animals at Hamm should:

• take a photo of your healthy CB reptile
• put a little report/bit of information about them/how well they are doing
• write a bit of what people are saying here...i.e. Morphs from the wild? How can the have checked the origin of every animal etc
• email/send it to them

After all...if we all do it then we might make a point! Maybe

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Contact information


Laurence Eve Van Atten, Development Coordinator
International Animal Rescue, US
PO Box 137, Shrewsbury, MA 01545

Email: info@internationalanimalrescue.org Phone: (50 826-1083

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I agree - they can produce no evidence whatsoever to back up their dramatic claims. I bet we never see a full report. In the tortoise neck of the woods we seen something familiar from an outfit called the Tortoise Protection Group. I've read bits of their report but cannot bring myself to join their Yahoo group and so cannot access the whole of it.

2 other points

1) What are the professional credentials of the good Dr Clifford? I note he is'nt a Veterinary Surgeon nor does he hold himself out as a Herpetologist or Zoologist. He has an impressive set of letters after his name. I wonder what they mean?

2) The over heated hall point - They're reptiles for Gods sake. They're meant to be kept warm. I would be more concerned if the halls were underheated. What we find uncomfortably warm is actually pretty cosy for the average reptile.

sorry all

but i have to agree with some of the issues raised..

yes, there are quite a few wild caught animals at the events, if houten was anything to go by, i personally recognised a few of the table holders, who i KNOW deal mainly in WC stock..

secondly, the conditions the animals are kept or displayed in... whilst there are some who make the effort to have decent display housing... again, there are many that do not...

i personally do not think that the table holders help the hobby, by having so many reptiles packed into small display tubs, lined along tables..

and yeah, that may make me unpopular, but whats new lol..

i personally think that the way reptiles are shown displayed and sold at reptile shows DOES need looking at.. i have said it before, and no doubt i will say it again, but, for instance, no i don't think it is fair on an adult leopard gecko, to spend all day in a cricket box with no access to hides/food or water.. especially not when it is then sat with 200 others stacked next to, above, and below. i do NOT think this portrays our hobby in a good light at all..

and having been a table holder at uk shows, i can understand why they are displayed as they are.. if you give a reptile a choice, it WILL hide away from view, and you WON'T make as many sales...

but does that not say something in itself?? that the reptile would rather hide away?? Mmmmmm

people display them as they do, because they make more money from doing so. not becasue the animals are comfier that way. whilst its all well and good to say.. ah well it doesn't do them any harm for a day... that still surely does not make it acceptable?

however, the comments about clifford (on this thread) i do agree with..

as do i the comments about the morphs, although again i would point out that i saw plenty of wildcaught ropey manky animals at houten, and have no reason to suspect hamm was any better! not to mention the fact that yes, the german market is well known for imports, both legal and otherwise.

so... whilst i do not agree with a lot of the spin in that article.. sorry guys, but there is some i DO agree with..

Nerys

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When you had stalls at shows, how did you have your animals displayed Nerys?

It might not be perfect for the animals, but most peoples housin they are kept in 'usually' isn't either.

A lot of the animals for sale as hatchlings and they are kept in tubs that I know a lot of breeders house them in for a good while from hatching (corns in crix tubs etc etc).

I don't agree with the amount of WC being portrayed as massive either, I saw at most 5 - 6 sellers who I know regularly deal in CF/WC but at least one of them was truthful about it and told me that a royal I was buyin was CF when I asked, there weren't many animals there either that looked WC to me, couple of invert stalls but thats the norm with inverts.

As for the 'doctor' he needs his head rearranging

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The xBiol letters are from the Institute of Biology.

In the last year of my Biology degree course we got a letter from them saying if we pay £XX you get to put the letters SBiol (or similar) after your name, the letter went on to say that they were well recognised in the Science community...would look good on the CV....blah blah etc. etc. S being for Student.

I paid the money (about £50 I think) and got the privilege of being able to put the letters after my name. Woo-hoo.

After Graduation you get the next letters, which was GBiol (Graduate Member of the Institute). But hang on a minute, you have to pay a bit more for the 'G'........Guess what.....I did.......

So...in the 10 years or so since I got the letters, take a wild guess how many people commented on them.......yep, thats right....0.

My subscription lapsed and I never renewed, though I did get a letter saying I may qualify for FBiol (Fellow) but that was bit more money....

Now, I'm not saying that it was a rip off, the institute runs seminars, sends out newsletters with some interesting articles in and if I had a more science based career then they may have come in quite handy, but it isn't exactly hard to get those letters.....

More meaningful to actually have the qualifications there e.g. if I was to use my full list it Would be
M4rky BSc (Hons) MSc BTEC

Then, if I had kept up with the subscriptions
M4rky BSc (Hons) MSc BTEC FBiol

Impressive, but the BSc and MSc show that I actually got the degrees, not just paid for (or got given) the Biol letters.

It's probably just to make him look more impressive to the general public, as far as I can see no actual qualifications after his name!

I think I can make some of his letters out, bear with me.....
important! warwick attacks Hamm!

I can for one tell you my young female BD that I got at the show is CB and is very healthy and active .

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