Sad, but very true
R

__________________

I understand what you mean they are the government laws but its the RSPCA that enforce them, what i meant was if the rep keepers were the ones to advise the RSPCA on the best way to care for the reps. (im not talking about people with no idea im talking about well known long term keepers) would that not then help all of us?
The RSPCA seem to have more 'clout' where the government is concerned compared to the bog standard herp keeper, so who are advising the government on the subject of reptiles on the animal welfare bill?
Would that person even know the difference between a corn and a royal?

Personal opinion we 'need' the RSPCA on our side sad i know but that seems the only way to be able to get the government to understand that just because a snake is 6ft long it does not need a 6 ft viv

In their mind how would we be able to house a 16ft burm? in a 16ft viv?

__________________

The RSPCA, the Animal Rights Organisiations ( Like CAPS, Animal Aid, ... ) and Chris Newman on behalf of FOCAS.

FOCAS is just one voice amid a chorus of other voices backed up with wads of cash.

This is why FOCAS needs the support of every keeper that it represents.

__________________
http://www.herpcare.org.uk - Herpetocultural Care Guides

http://www.happinet.co.uk

So basically our representation on the awb is Chris Newman?
If that is what you are saying that means amist all the people that are supporting the 'small furies' we only have a droplet in a huge puddle?
Would it not make sense then to have more than one person that has dealt with exotics to be on board?

I could possibly just not be understanding you correctly though so if thats the case im sorry in advance

__________________

Would it not be right to say htat our representation SHOULd lie within every keeper int he UK??

Yes, from a political angle, there needsto be a team who deal directly with other groups, politicians etc but where does that person or team get thier support from?

Should be each adn every single one of us don't ya think

__________________


SITE NOT UP YET - PLEASE VIEW AT WWW.FREEWEBS.COM/GRACEFULCORSETRY/INDEX.HTM

Please sign the guestbook - feedback much appreciated

APOLOGIES FOR ANY PM'S I HAVE NOT REPLIED TO - SOME SAD PERSON ACCESSED MY ACCOUNT WITHOUT MY PERMISSION!

I 100% agree with that yes we should all support the person that is representing us to the government where the awb is concerned.

sounds silly but just like it is with all other kinds of issues in this country its no longer "united we stand, divided we fall" its "divided we stand untied we fall" and no matter how hard we try to change that at the end of the day it boils down to the fact that 90% of people in the country will not stand up for what they believe in due to the fact they are petrified of what consequences they will face

__________________

Our main representation on the AWA is FOCAS. Chris Newman is the chairman of FOCAS and attends meetings on behalf of all the societies that FOCAS represents. As far as I am aware, FOCAS is drawing up it's own codes of practise for the AWA, which of course we would like to see implemented. But the others also want to see theirs implemented.

I believe there are a few other societies that represent keepers but these are vastly outnumbered by as Rory puts it, those that oppose us. So yes, by far our main voice is Chris Newman.

Our hobby does not have any political representation other than the FBH and FOCAS and Chris is the chairman of both... so Faith, unless someone is prepared to give up their time to help and go to meetings and become a target for the Animal rights campaigners... who do you suggest stands up there with him ?

__________________
http://www.herpcare.org.uk - Herpetocultural Care Guides

http://www.happinet.co.uk

Im not saying i suggest any particular single person to stand with him i suggest all herp keepers if they agree with the policies of FOCUS stand with them. After all is it not US that its affecting?
As ive said before it really annoys me that there are people that love keeping reptiles but are not willing to stand up for their right to have them as pets in the long run

Id personally give up some of the spare time i have to talk to my MP etc about the awb as long as i had guidance from the correct people on how to go about it and what questions need to be answered first

__________________

Sorry hun, I knew what you were saying. I should not have put your name there as the questions was supposed to be rhetorical

Apologies ... it was not aimed at you... but at the hobby in general.

It would be great if we had other bodies willing to stand alongside FOCAS in the political arena and fight for our rights to keep our pets in the best way possible and not as dictated to by people with little or no experience.

__________________
http://www.herpcare.org.uk - Herpetocultural Care Guides

http://www.happinet.co.uk

They will not listen because they have no interest in doing so, It's already been tried. They have outright refused help from major reptile societies and won't work with them. The RSPCA upper management long ago decided that people should not be keeping reptiles. They have published reports to support their position on this that contain outright fictitious information that was obviously not researched at all. Everything you see now is part of a gradual drift towards the removal of reptiles from private keeping.

It's amazing how many laywers and full time lobbyists, not to mention political favours can be bought with the level of funding they have. As has been mentioned, something like 6p from every pound gets to the front line while they have enough money in the bank to buy a small country, or failing that, fund the invasion.

Unless you could seriously tear apart and restructure the core of the organisation, that will never happen. Their objective is to gradually get rid of us, not to ensure to continuation of the hobby. Until that changes, on some level they will always represent 'the enemy' of private keepers.

__________________
-Oni


2.4 E. macularius, 1.2 H. caudicinctus, 1.0 R. ciliatus
0.2.1 A. fragilis, 1.1 T. merianae, 1.0 V. niloticus ittibittius
3.4 P. guttattus, 1.0 P. guttatus X E. climacophora, 1.0 P. o. rossalini, 1.0 P. o. lindheimeri, 0.1 E. anomala
1.2 Lamprophis spp, 1.0 L. g. nigritus, 0.1 L. g. californiae
1.2 E. c. maurus, 1.1 E. c. loveridgei, 0.1 E. conicus
1.4 P. regius, 1.1 A. maculosa, 1.0 H. n. nasicus