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13-12-2007, 02:43 PM
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The chicken thing has nothing to do with digestion. It's about actually getting the bone into the gut and not getting stuck on the way down  I have a sammoyed. She has been brought up around all manner of animals and i trust her implicitly with any animal. Not that i would any other (no matter what breed), but i know my dog in this case.
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13-12-2007, 02:48 PM
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i blooming well you have permission to take pheseants with dogs and rifle as i would be very annoyed if you came on my shoot taking my pheseasnt!
BARF is an excellent way to feed dogs, i have 6 working dogs and there all adore BARF there get all the left overs from the butchers and all the bits are dont want one i have plucked and drawn my game.
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 snakes- 0:1 Macklotts water Python, 10 Royal Pythons 18 Corns, 21 boas various hets and morphs, 1 diadem rat snake, 3 baird rat snakes, 2 hoggies, 4 sand boas, 2 tai beauty snakes, 1 albino burmese....
Lizards- 2 Bearded dragons, 4 yellow throated plated lizards, 5 Birbon geckos, 16 leos, 4 fat tails, 3 tokay geckos, 1 curly tailed lizard, 2 dwarf sungazers Other animals- 7 Labrador, 3 ferrets, 10 degus, 3 chins, 1 chipmunks, 100mice n rats, 20 odd gerbils, , 7 hamsters, 13 spiny mice, 2 stripey mice, 4 guniea fowl, 2 old english game chickens, 2:2 cream legbars, 6 silver applyard ducks, 1:3 Gold Dutch Chickens, 1:2 Black Turkeys, 4 Bourbon red turkeys, 5 Bronze Turkey
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13-12-2007, 02:53 PM
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the butcher gets the meat on the carcass. the butcher takes the meat off the carcass. the butcher has to pay to have the carcass disposed of. For them to give it away they save money and if they charge a few quid then they make a few quid. Ask about on Freecycle for a freezer, i tried but with it being close to Christmas not many people were giving them away. I paid £36 for a 2x3x2 chest freezer on ebay. Quote:
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 I gots 1.0.0 Royal python (Snakiei wakieri) - 1.0.0 Staffy cross (mutii doggii) - 0.1.0 Northern inuit (wolfi likii) 1.0.17 tropical fish (fishii wishii) 1.0.0 Whites Tree Frog (Froggeh Woggii) I wants 0.1.0 CWD (chinkii winkii dragonii) - 0.0.?? tropical fish (fishii wishiis) for my gift swap stalker (if i have one) - i need a second hand UV starter for a 3/4ft tube, a second hand dimming stat or possibly some friend(s) for Colin my WTF or any fun random crap
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13-12-2007, 03:16 PM
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Yes, we have lots and lots of permission lol Don't worry
 As for the chicken bones, it's already been said that they are completely safe RAW. However I do want to expand on the fact...Someone mentioned feeding their Saffy lamb chops. While you're to be applauded for giving him/her some real food, just a friendly word of warning. When feeding raw food and raw meaty bones, the food items should be as whole (i.e. as near to a piece of animal) as possible. Lamb chops contain a small cutlet of bone inside a steak, and this does present (or should I say CAN present) a choking hazard. Not because it's bone, but because it's a piece so small the dog will likely just swallow it in one go. All raw food should be in big pieces, how big depends on the size of the dog. So chicken quarters rather than wings for small dogs, whole chickens rather than quarters for larger dogs; breast of lamb and whole rib racks instead of cutlets; you get the idea. If the bone is whole inside the meat as it would have been present on the animal (or better yet just the whole animal!), the dog has to chew and work at getting food from the 'prey'. This chewing is what maintains oral health in predators such as dogs and cats, and indeed lack of it (eg in commercially fed animals) facilitates the development of periodontal disease, organ failure and early death. Raw feeding is entirely safe, provides a 'complete' diet in the true meaning of the word (you don't need anything else) and it's not hard. It's not science either - who here measures, weighs and calculates their kid's food in case they die of nutritional imbalance? Yet people seem deathly afraid of not feeding dry food in case their dog dies a miserable death (pet food manufacturers have done a great job with propaganda over the years!). My dogs have had nothing but raw food and kitchen scraps all their lives, from weaning to adulthood - never a problem. They're lean, strong and fit as the proverbial butcher's. The oldest is nearly 9 btw. You find they grow slightly SLOWER than commercially fed animals (they're not getting "bulked up"), but this is beneficial for organs and joints (think hip dysplasia in commercially fed large breeds). Indeed the world record for longevity goes to a raw fed dog who was nearly 30!!!! Raw fed dogs tend to live a long and healthy life without illness (mine have never been ill except for working injury). Then they just don't wake up one day - they 'fall off the perch'. That's in contrast to commercially fed dogs, who develop bad breath, tartar, low grade systemic organ failure (often not diagnosed as such), they become stiff and sore, they don't run around any more as they get "older" (who on earth considers 8 to 10 "old" for a dog?!), then they die a slow miserable death - effectively poisoned to death by commercial food and the resulting periodontal disease. Reticulatus - no, it doesn't promote aggression in the "raw food makes dogs have bloodlust" sense mate. I do see where you're coming from (feed a dog a whole rabbit and suddenly Fluffy seems attractive!), and in that sense it MAY be a problem for some dogs. In that case feed without the skin/fur and don't associate meal times with the pet rabbit. Easy. My eldest hunting dog Zac grew up with my sister's rabbits and cavies. He'd be out at 4am with me, pulling rabbits off the lamp and working his heart out, go home for a big meal, and then curl up in front of the TV with my sister's free-running bunny between his legs LOL They do know the difference if they're brought up with them 
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15 years a keeper and lovin' it Last edited by Rainmaker; 13-12-2007 at 03:22 PM.
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13-12-2007, 03:28 PM
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13-12-2007, 03:30 PM
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if feeding lamb can I put mint sauce on it to stop Rio's breath smelling like arse?
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I gots 1.0.0 Royal python (Snakiei wakieri) - 1.0.0 Staffy cross (mutii doggii) - 0.1.0 Northern inuit (wolfi likii) 1.0.17 tropical fish (fishii wishii) 1.0.0 Whites Tree Frog (Froggeh Woggii) I wants 0.1.0 CWD (chinkii winkii dragonii) - 0.0.?? tropical fish (fishii wishiis) for my gift swap stalker (if i have one) - i need a second hand UV starter for a 3/4ft tube, a second hand dimming stat or possibly some friend(s) for Colin my WTF or any fun random crap
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13-12-2007, 03:40 PM
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If you move him over to large raw meaty bones (which will cost you next to nothing if you do it right), you'll find his teeth become clean again and his breath stops stinking. When fed commercial food (dry or wet), the stuff accumulates along the gum line and becomes rancid. Then bacteria gets to work and causes inflammation, smells (byproduct of their spoiling the food) and tooth/gum disease. Periodontal disease sets in and causes bad breath in itself. How old is the dog, and how bad are its teeth? Dental chews, dental kibble (a laughable oxymoron) and so on will NOT fix this. A raw fed dog will never have smelly breath (until they eat something they shouldn't  ).EDIT - "How bad are its teeth" means every single one of them should be "Holywood White", no matter how old the dog. Check them between, behind and especially the back teeth. Any sign of yellowing, tartar etc is bad.
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15 years a keeper and lovin' it
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13-12-2007, 03:42 PM
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he's about 10 years old, breath isn't that bad half the time but his teeth don't look too great and he won't sit still to let me brush them.
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I gots 1.0.0 Royal python (Snakiei wakieri) - 1.0.0 Staffy cross (mutii doggii) - 0.1.0 Northern inuit (wolfi likii) 1.0.17 tropical fish (fishii wishii) 1.0.0 Whites Tree Frog (Froggeh Woggii) I wants 0.1.0 CWD (chinkii winkii dragonii) - 0.0.?? tropical fish (fishii wishiis) for my gift swap stalker (if i have one) - i need a second hand UV starter for a 3/4ft tube, a second hand dimming stat or possibly some friend(s) for Colin my WTF or any fun random crap
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13-12-2007, 03:51 PM
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 I'm not laughing at you mate, honestly. I do find it "funny" how pet food manufacturer's propaganda worms its way into hearts and minds though. Dogs don't need their teeth brushing, PERIOD. Even if you did it, it's totally ineffective (it sells lots of dental chews, kibbles and doggy toothpaste though £$£$£). It may (MAY) be worth biting the bullet for a scale and polish at the vets. But first just try a month on whole RMBs etc, and see how they look. You may be lucky and his teeth come right just with good food. As Tom Lonsdale would say, "Carcases are nature's toothbrush for predators". If he can fit it in his mouth all in one go, it's too small. Yes for dogs like Rotties that means BIG food, but it won't cost you any more if you do it right. Local hunters, abattoirs, poultry wholesalers, you name it - they will mostly all give away for free whole RMBs if you get an agreement going to collect regularly. The crucial part is the chewing, ripping, tearing and nibbling needed for a dog to eat a LARGE (compared to him/her) food item. This stresses the teeth and gingiva, scrapes and polishes them, massages the gums and keeps the oral cavity in tip-top condition. Anything small enough to be bolted, crunched once or twice and swallowed, is useless. My dogs will literally surround a carcass and tear it apart pack-style before consuming it. Their teeth look GREAT!  LOL Even on his own, he can eat whole pigs heads, piglets, rabbits, whole fish, rib racks (from cows, pigs, sheep etc)... all of these foods can be found free of charge if you look hard enough.See how you get on - and please stop the commercial food. Save your wallet AND his life.
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15 years a keeper and lovin' it
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13-12-2007, 04:16 PM
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they'll both be on it soon enough, freezer tonight followed by meat soon.
whats got me confused now is they say chicken wings are good but if the food can't be small enough to eat in one, where do you get these enhanced super chickens from with huge wings instead of the farty little things i get from Asda?
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I gots 1.0.0 Royal python (Snakiei wakieri) - 1.0.0 Staffy cross (mutii doggii) - 0.1.0 Northern inuit (wolfi likii) 1.0.17 tropical fish (fishii wishii) 1.0.0 Whites Tree Frog (Froggeh Woggii) I wants 0.1.0 CWD (chinkii winkii dragonii) - 0.0.?? tropical fish (fishii wishiis) for my gift swap stalker (if i have one) - i need a second hand UV starter for a 3/4ft tube, a second hand dimming stat or possibly some friend(s) for Colin my WTF or any fun random crap
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