That was me trying to translate 'panties in a knot' which is a western saying that I like... it didn't work????

Live and learn.

kinda the same thing... I like that too but there's something not right with the phrase.

The question of whether to hibernate or not is a personal choice.
As i've suggested in similar threads, hibernation is a survival mechanism to escape low temperatures and therefore if the threat of low temperatures is removed, then hibernation will not take place and is not a necessity.
With the current climate in this country sometimes not being conducive to hibernation, many keepers now use the fridge method. Therefore you decide whether you are going to provide unnaturally cold conditions, i.e. a fridge to promote hibernation, or provide light and heat in order to deter them from this.
You will find neither fridges nor artificial heat and light in their natural habitat, so hibernation in a fridge cannot be considered more natural than overwintering.

Well said and simply put.
Currently I do hibernate as I am lucky enough to have a good brick outbuilding and I intend to experiment with some buried boxes with natural medium for some of my hardier, wiser, older adults..I have 25 torts in total.
However if the time comes that temps are not low enough to hibernate,,,,then I wont force them to do it....or....maybe not in my time!!
Of course they "hibernate" in the colder end of their ranges...they are reptiles they cant function without heat!! The only "natural" thing about it is that...a response to cold...if there is no cold...they stay "awake"
As for the arguement that they will pyramid/grow too quickly...
they are hot...they eat...they use up energy.
they are cold...they dont eat... they dont use up energy.
They may get to a bigger size sooner but that shouldnt be a problem....but if all the other spots are hit...they could remain nice and smooth.

The same dispiriting posts are starting to pop up on other forums - 'my tortoise did'nt survive hibernation' or 'I've revived my tortoise and he is'nt eating or drinking'. Not only that but these are people who have done their hibernation in a careful, controlled manner. OK there are plenty of 'success stories' as well but I think it's important that this issue is thoroughly debated / examining. The bottom line is that hibernation is catastrophic for a significant number of captive tortoises annually and it's not necessarily because the keeper did it incorrectly. If there are positive health related reasons for hibernating a tortoise then I would like to see 'scientific' evidence rather than anecdotal 'theories' - ie they get to fat if over wintered, they won't breed, they'll get pyramiding, it drastically reduces their lifespan etc.

I don't think that you will see the evidence for all these things from anyone and I would suggest that dying is a bigger health risk to a tortoise than gaining a little extra weight during the winter, a problem, which if it exists is simple to remedy.

I agree - If there was decent scientific evidence (ideally a peer reviewed paper in a well regarded publication by a veterinary surgeon, zoologist or biologist) then sceptic's such as myself would have been pointed in it's direction.

The lifespan argument really gets my goat because there is absolutely no evidence that hibernation affects it a positive way. My unscientic assessment suggests completely the opposite. Hibernation can and does kill. I wonder what % of wild tortoises survive it?

This applies to many of the myths surrounding tortoise husbandry, many of which have no scientific evidence to support them but are merely the opinions of few, blindly perpetuated by many.