Not your fault mate Always annoys me when shops give people wrong information, they should either say nothing or admit they aren't sure. Some shops are very good and know their stuff, others however have no right selling reptiles.

There are a couple of good sites for info, Markus Jayne, Ball pythons | ballpython.ca is a good one, also happens to be where most of my royals came from, and the NERD site is always a good choice for a little drooling NERD - New England Reptile Distributors - NERD's Ball Python Collection

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www.draco2.co.uk

Unfortunately, the shop has misled you.

A "het spider" LOOKS like a spider - if it doesn't look like a Spider it doesn't carry the gene at all.

I will argue that there certainly IS a "het" spider (a spider with only one copy of the spider gene, and one copy of the normal not-spider gene) - but these animals do not look like normals.

You will get some spider hatchlings if you breed your female to a spider male, because the spider gene is dominant - and your resulting spider offspring are the "het" spiders (they can't be homozygous because one parent is a normal). The normals from that pairing are just normals and do not carry the spider gene at all.

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- Ssthisto





Lizards: 2.1 E. macularius1.2 H. caudicinctus1.0 R. ciliatus0.3 A. fragilis0.0.1 T. gigas ssp1.1 T. merianae1.0 V. niloticus ittibittiusColubrids: 6.8.6 P. guttattus1.0 P. guttatus X E. climacophora1.1 P. o. rossalini1.0 P. o. lindheimeri0.1 E. anomala0.1 C. radiatus0.2 Lamprophis spp1.0 L. g. nigritus0.1 L. g. californiae1.0 H. n. nasicus1.0 P. m. melanoleucusBoids: 1.1 E. c. maurus 0.1 E. conicus10.14.4 P. regius1.1 A. maculosa
Member 1606 ... We HAD a three-bedroom house... Current lodgers: 1.0 E. c. maurus, 0.1 P. regius

So assuming there is no super form of spider, although a spider to spider breeding should still produce homo offspring, would these then produce 100% spider in future breedings?

Yes, you're spot on. Like you said though, with there being no 'super-form', you wouldn't be able to tell by looking only by breeding the snake out will it give you your answer as to whether it is a homo or hetero spider.

I'm sure someone will correct me if i'm wrong but as far as I know there is no such thing as a 'super spider' or homo spider. Ie a spider that produces all spiders when bred to a normal. Should be but aint.

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Mason

1.0 of "Quixotic_Axotlotl"





http://masonexotics.co.uk/ourcollection.aspx

Locality Boas and Retics A Passion.

There's no PROVEN homozygous spiders... but then, how many people breed spider to spider nowadays given that you don't NEED to in order to get Spider offspring?

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- Ssthisto





Lizards: 2.1 E. macularius1.2 H. caudicinctus1.0 R. ciliatus0.3 A. fragilis0.0.1 T. gigas ssp1.1 T. merianae1.0 V. niloticus ittibittiusColubrids: 6.8.6 P. guttattus1.0 P. guttatus X E. climacophora1.1 P. o. rossalini1.0 P. o. lindheimeri0.1 E. anomala0.1 C. radiatus0.2 Lamprophis spp1.0 L. g. nigritus0.1 L. g. californiae1.0 H. n. nasicus1.0 P. m. melanoleucusBoids: 1.1 E. c. maurus 0.1 E. conicus10.14.4 P. regius1.1 A. maculosa
Member 1606 ... We HAD a three-bedroom house... Current lodgers: 1.0 E. c. maurus, 0.1 P. regius

I don't see why not, take pastels as an example, the only reason we know that there is a homozygous/super form is because it's visible.

If you breed a super pastel (homo pastel) to a normal, the offspring will all be pastel (het super pastel) so the genetic rules say that there should be a 'super' or homo form of a spider (not visibly different to a het spider) that when bred to a normal gives you 100% spiders (all het spiders).

Where as a 'het' spider to a normal would be a 50% 'het' spider and 50% normal clutch. Just as it would be with a pastel to a normal.

It is how the spider gene should act..but as far as anyone knows doesn't.

If 'super spiders' were doable then there would havebeen some for sale by now, spiders aren't worth enbough money to warrent breeders holding back every single one and enough morphs CONTAINING the spider gene are bred together these days, this negates the need for spider x spider pairings.

4-5 years ago i'd have beleived that it was simply a case of breeders not selling them, but I can now get spiders in the US for under £200, I refuse to beleive breeders are bothered about keeping them.

there should be 'super spiders' but the spider gene has been around the bl.ock now...and no one has yet come forward with one.

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Mason

1.0 of "Quixotic_Axotlotl"





http://masonexotics.co.uk/ourcollection.aspx

Locality Boas and Retics A Passion.

How many times do you think Kevin at NERD tried spider to spider??? Quite a few times I would say. If there was such thing as a "Super" spider weather it was a visible trait or not it would be WELL documented. And for anyone thinking that maybe someone is keeping it a secret, forget about it. There would be a huge market for a super spider if it existed!

Well, do Spider to Spider crosses have a 25% proportion of dead eggs?

That's the only way I could see that there are not homozygous spiders out there... if it's a homozygous lethal.

Keep in mind that Spider is apparently a DOMINANT gene - there is no visually distinctive "super". Unless, of course, the trainwrecky spinners are the visual super - which is conjecture on my part, not fact.

__________________
- Ssthisto





Lizards: 2.1 E. macularius1.2 H. caudicinctus1.0 R. ciliatus0.3 A. fragilis0.0.1 T. gigas ssp1.1 T. merianae1.0 V. niloticus ittibittiusColubrids: 6.8.6 P. guttattus1.0 P. guttatus X E. climacophora1.1 P. o. rossalini1.0 P. o. lindheimeri0.1 E. anomala0.1 C. radiatus0.2 Lamprophis spp1.0 L. g. nigritus0.1 L. g. californiae1.0 H. n. nasicus1.0 P. m. melanoleucusBoids: 1.1 E. c. maurus 0.1 E. conicus10.14.4 P. regius1.1 A. maculosa
Member 1606 ... We HAD a three-bedroom house... Current lodgers: 1.0 E. c. maurus, 0.1 P. regius