Do you happen to know what locality this spider was from? Or was it CB? If its WC, it could be a natural hybrid, and that would be interesting.

It's been a few months since I studied speciation and such in detail (1), but I could perhaps help a little if you want. I did study hybridisation as a means of speciation, and the methods involved in hybrid sterility/fertility. I could dig out my old notes and see if I could direct you to further reading if you want...



(1) A few months sounds trivial I know, but I feel like everything new I learn pushes out the old! I'm an ecologist at heart, so evolution and speciation is a little bit of a tangent for me

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Brachypelma albopilosum (Charlotte)
B. Schroederi (slings)
Grammostola sp. "North" Northern gold
G. aurerostriata (slings)
Cyclosternum fasciatum (slings)

Member of the BAS and AAS.

Thanks GRB, I would be interested to read more so long as it isnt too technical I'm not overly clever.

This little guy of mine was left on my doorstep just over a year ago at only 1+ inches. I thought to start with that he was a B. vagans but with each moult and change it looks more likely that he is an albop/vagans hybrid. I have absolutely no information as to where he came from. If he came from a pet shop there is a possibility that he is wild caught but its more likely that he was captive bred.

No worries, I struggle with hardcore evolution/speciation topics, and I studied them to death

I also didnt realise that hybrid tarantulas really existed (except natural ones), and that it was such a contentious issue :/ I guess I am on the other side really; I breed carnivorous plants (well, used to), where hybrids are actively encouraged...

I've just clicked that vagans and albio shouldnt really ever cross paths in the wild, so a WC natural hybrid is unlikely.

Anything you need help with, let me know. I am currently searching for any literature that might be of interest, although it seems to be thin on the ground...

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Brachypelma albopilosum (Charlotte)
B. Schroederi (slings)
Grammostola sp. "North" Northern gold
G. aurerostriata (slings)
Cyclosternum fasciatum (slings)

Member of the BAS and AAS.

Hybrids for your enjoyment - Page 2 - ATS Message Board

In this thread (its been mentioned a few times on other posts), it suggests there is a multi-generational population of albopilosum x vagans in europe - the F1 is fertile seemingly. I cant find a picture however.

I cant seem to find much on specific species hybrids, natural hybrids or such in tarantulas. I'll keep looking.

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Brachypelma albopilosum (Charlotte)
B. Schroederi (slings)
Grammostola sp. "North" Northern gold
G. aurerostriata (slings)
Cyclosternum fasciatum (slings)

Member of the BAS and AAS.

Thanks once again GRB.

If the F1 is fertile I see no reason why later generations cant be fertile too unless dilution of the original species causes infertility further down the line?

I dont think there has been much, if any, study done on tarantula hybrids so like you I cant find very much to go on so far.

Its a shame my boy is a hybrid because he cant go on to do what nature intended so is destined to live as a pet. I will just do my best for him when he matures and hope he doesnt get too stressed out by not having a female.

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My T's0.0.10 A.versicolor0.1.1 A.bicegoi0.0.1 A.purpurea0.0.2 A.cf purpurea0.0.2 A.azuraklaasi1.0.2 A.peru purple0.0.5 A.Amazonica0.0.11 A.sp fasciculata0.0.1 A.braunshauseni0.0.2 A. metallica0.1.1 A.Kwitara river1.1.0 B.klaasi1.0.0 B.smithi0.0.2 B.schroederi0.0.2 B.albiceps0.1.0 B.boehmei0.0.1 B.emilia0.1.0 B.verdezi0.0.1 C.cyaneopubescens1.0.2 E.truculentus0.0.1 E.Montane0.0.1 E.vulpinus0.0.1 G.aureostriata1.0.1 G.iheringi1.0.0 G.rosea0.0.2 G.pulchra0.2.0 G.grossa0.1.0 G.alticeps0.0.1 G.North1.0.0 G. sp.formosa0.0.1 H.gigas0.0.1 H.lividum0.0.2 L.polycuspulatus0.0.1 L.parahybana0.0.10 P.cambridgei0.0.1 P.miranda0.0.1 T.apophysis0.0.2 X.immanis0.0.2 Y.Koh samui

do any of you have the eugine bruins book called the terrarium there are around six pictures in it of hybrid spiders or maybe not just had look theres 3 lol on page 142 hope this help some how lol

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I am unsure - it would depend on how you crossed it. A backcross to one of the parents might have different results to a cross against another species, or the same hybrid. I dont really know enough about genetics to fully answer that to be honest. I think a backcross would be interesting, but theres no point unless you could be 100% sure of its parentage.

It is a shame he is reduced to that (well, I only keep mine as pets, so I guess its not that bad, lol). I dont want to stir contoversy here, but hybrids are not IMO a bad thing in the wild; a lot of species actually originated via hybrids in hyrbid zones, and natural hybridisation is quite common. In the hobby however, I can see numerous problems.

I used to breed carnivorous plants, where hybrids are almost encouraged - they display increased growth and survival. In plants aswell, the proper notation is already commonplace - there is no incentive to lie about a plants origins, and crosses such as "Nepenthes [(fusca x rajah) x (fusca x subfusca) x fusca] are commonplace, and indeed sought after (often at increased price due to the massive effort involved to breed such a monster).

I cant see such truth occurring in tarantulas however, too many people seem to want to offer the next "new" item. The other issue is that it could go boths ways in inverts - inbreeding depression seems to have lesser effects on them than mammals etc, but there is no way to tell what successive crosses would do...

It might be interesting if you document any illnesses/deviations that arize from this hybrid - sometimes hybrids can be unfit, but in other cases thy can show increased vigour and growth, or behavioural changes. Since there is so little to go on, your data might be quite valuable.

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Brachypelma albopilosum (Charlotte)
B. Schroederi (slings)
Grammostola sp. "North" Northern gold
G. aurerostriata (slings)
Cyclosternum fasciatum (slings)

Member of the BAS and AAS.

Well whatever the little fella is...he sure looks mighty dam cute, and in his little spider world i dont suppose he minds either, as he look's beautifully cared for and loved.Just a shame someone felt they had to dump him.

Hybrid spiders don't occur in the wild. Same species don't live close enough to each other.

It's a man made mistake and i don't think it should be done in anything, whether it be plants or animals. But there ya go! However, im aware it does occur in plants in the wild due to pollenation etc

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I cant argue with spiders in the present, but if you want, I can discuss other hybrid issues (there are some good papers on the issue of hybrid zone speciation). Its actually very, very common in the wild, even outside of plants. Without hybridisation, we would not have the majority of the species of animals we have today. its very likely that it happened in the past as well, including in spiders, so in that case its not a man made issue.

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Brachypelma albopilosum (Charlotte)
B. Schroederi (slings)
Grammostola sp. "North" Northern gold
G. aurerostriata (slings)
Cyclosternum fasciatum (slings)

Member of the BAS and AAS.