Surely they would have at least 2 burrows/hides? Just incase a predator finds the burrow and scares the T out. Then wouldnt the T need like a backup hide?

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Not unless it is trying out for a role in a new series of the A Team.

Anyway, I am quite sure that even if you gave yer T a viv that was ten foot square, it would still want to wander off, if you left the door to the viv open.

Take what you want from that!

Could it be to do with the vibrations from the outside of the tank?

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Perhaps, but if you mean people etc moving around, then those vibes would be heavy one's, therefore, more akin to something that might prey on it, therefore, it would seem unlikely (I think?), that they would attempt to head toward the source of the noise...

Steve: There's nothing to suggest that the invert has any comprehension that what is outside the tank is different to inside...so when you word is as "why would it leave the safety of the tank" - there is no 'tank', nor 'safety' to the invert if you follow the logic that they are automotons like you suggest.

Simply put, they might try to escape because the container is too small. I certainly feel that pedes might need a massive enclosure to be close to natural territories. Even our humble british wolf spider can patrol a territory 5m^2, which is pretty huge compared to how small it is. A 12" pede might naturally wander quite far, and never establish a "home base" like a tank set up forces it to do.

I don't really buy into that simple invert theory. I think its rather Victorian, and time it needs to be updated. Even fundamentals such as pain recognition is flawed, in that we try to define pain as how we feel it. Since insects cannot voice pain nor communicate it, how do we decipher it correctly? As far as i'm concerned, pain is detection of mechanical stimulus that is damaging to the self.

I don't know, I just feel it is disrespectful to assume that insects are so simple in their behaviour when there is so much we cannot even comprehend, nor understand. I'm not saying they are on par with humans in intelligence, but I hardly think we can treat them as glorified cell cultures either.

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dear, i really have always had a problem with this 'pain' theory.
essentially my understandings are that they are aware, even if approximately, of how much pressure you exert on them, and react in relation to how much pressure there is.
you touch them, theres a slight reaction, you sqeeze them 'hard' theyl do their best to escape frantically.
If they can do that, imo they will feel pain, the harder theyr sqeezed the more they struggle.

Pain is only a measure for an organism, im sure theres many different ways other than a nervous system to 'measure' pain.

I agree too with the theory of them as glorified cell cultures. Theyv been around longer, and REAL intelligence is judged on the species, and related to time.
We always pressume their dumb, but i dont beleive an order of animals thats been around for soooooo long could be dumb, its stupid.
in terms of evolution, they are more hundreds of millions, if not a billion years(cnt remember exactly) more advanced than us.
Whats to say evolution hasnt simply phased out conscious thoughts for them as its deemed unneccessary and only an inhibitor for life.
If you have preprogrammed reactions to stimulus. That covers most situations in nature, then why need conscious..which will only restrict and hold you back.
Thats the reason i think most people are scared of them so, with out knowing..
They could have simply evolved through soft exoskeletons, to a more stable, and

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Yeah, yer probably right with this, and most of what else you wrote.

In which case then, I suppose all of us, even those who feel that they have replicated an environment 'really well' are unwittingly adding to the stress of a creature, be that a pede, a T, or whatever, by keeping it confined to a tank, at all.

Disagree with a T really, i think if a tarantula, T blondi for example fell into an open top glass tank in the amazon, that actually was cool enough for them and fullfilled an ideal hide and a supply of crix, then the tarantula would not move far from it during its life, always coming back.
I do thin other inverts such as solifuges and pedes are probably too nomadic for this, they would be trying to travel some, its their nature and instinct to be on the move, solifuges more i imagine. (pedes will often stay in a burrow for months a time depending on circumstances)
Ofcourse theres levels of stress, every living animal has stress in the life, be it from predators or from humans, or simply from lack of habitat, its all about tolerance and how much.
If your supplying an adequate enclosure, the animal feeds, molts, breeds and lives a long life then i think the levels of stress are going to be at a low level

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I agree.

It is all degrees at the end of the day.

I read lots of threads on this forum about 'ethical practice' etc, and often wonder how many of those people engage in other unethical practice, or at least serve the trade, on a daily basis in their lives.

Do they sometimes take the car, rather than walk?

If so, they are contributing to the destruction of the enviornment.

If they eat meat, how many ensure that every scrap of meat that they eat has been 'treated ethically'...

To me, you cannot pick and choose ethics like sweets in a shop, and it is very hard to live an entirely 'ethical' life, unless you are a Buddist who lives in the mountains!

I do think that housing can have a large impact on how our inverts decide to behave. I recently re housed a chile rose from a viv with a hide to an exo terra with a much deeper layer of substrate. It is the first time i have had a chilean construct an elaborate burrow for itself. It now only ventures out at night and retreats back to its burrow as soon as feels vibrations from the door opening. I suppose the only way one will get to the bottom of this is for one of us to keep a pede in an area approaching its wild area of ranging.

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