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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 26-01-2017, 03:50 AM
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To clarify the situation. Whist the williamsi became an Appendix 1 , (Annex A) species on 2nd January this year, the EU has not passed this change into law yet.

It is further muddled by the fact that Tanzanian government has said that there have been no legal exports of the species, when in fact they were exported just as Lygodactylus species. If it is deemed to be the case DEFFRA will not issue any article 10 certificates as all specimens including captivebred ones will not be legal !

If they are to be deemed legal then there is the question of identifying them. Apparently nano microchips are still too large unless inserted into the body cavity.

It's a big mess really.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 26-01-2017, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathanb View Post
Yes you do - L williamsi officially went CITES I on the 02 of January this year, the only way to trade them is it apply via the APHA for the appropriate a10 certificate.

It's in French, but its on this link , clear as day with the annex number and the date:
https://cites.application.developpem...on.do?id=28148
As I said you don't need any paperwork yet, it will be around the end of Feb, don't put off people buying them we need as many people as possible to keep and breed them and I don't read French
And it not clear as day is it!!
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 26-01-2017, 10:23 PM
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They will become Annexe A on the 29th of January.
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Old 26-01-2017, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by colinm View Post
They will become Annexe A on the 29th of January.
A real shame really but if you look on the Hamm classifieds everyone is selling them off.
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Old 26-01-2017, 10:40 PM
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Yes they are.

This is a real tragedy for the species.
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 26-01-2017, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colinm View Post
Yes they are.

This is a real tragedy for the species.
It is as they are still been exported under different species, it's sad that people are selling them off because they can't breed them for a profit.

I better start filling out the paperwork then, I'm not sure regarding the microchip!
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Old 31-01-2017, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colinm View Post
Yes they are.

This is a real tragedy for the species.
Sure is.

I sold the last of mine on last year. I was attempting breeding, alas now too messy for me. I am sure I am not the only one.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 09-02-2017, 02:40 PM
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I've been trying to purchase some of these over the last few weeks and i contacted APHA directly as there was various opinions on the effective date of the new legislation and to whom it applied as the words i had been told were all commercial sales.

I have spoken direct with a CITES Licencing Officer at APHA and the effective date for L williamsi was 4th February 2017. it applies to anyone trade, retail or home breeders selling or transferring ownership of the species. The only way you can pass them to a new owner legally is by donation ( no transaction) even an non monetary exchange classes as a transaction and requires licencing.

The trouble with donation of animals means the new owner needs papers to be able to breed and sell from purchased animals and also if they decide to resell the animals at a future date.

A licence can be applied for for specimens obtained before the effective date of this new legislation but the application requires to know the source of the animals ie captive bred, wild caught etc etc and if they are captive bred the origin of the parents and so on this is near impossible for most of the L williamsi currently in the UK to trace back the origins by one or two generations.


In my opinion this new legislation will result in people not being able to sell captive UK animals and drive up prices of those for sale to cover the costs of the licence fees and those people looking for the species rather than purchase UK bred animals will seek them elsewhere, be it captive or wild... I am entirely in agreement of protecting this and other species in the wild from the illegal pet trade but i think existing UK or European captive bred specimens should have been exempted from the imposed legislation and the free availability of animals would make it easier for breeders/ keepers to obtain the animals captive bred here in the UK.

I dont think this will be in the best interest of the specimens already in captivity in the Uk as it will make captive breeding very expensive and difficult for hobby breeders.



ps if anyone would like to DONATE some williamsi im more than happy to accept.....
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Old 10-02-2017, 11:38 AM
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We will probably see some sales of a box of crickets for £90.00 with a free DONATED williamsi...

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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 10-02-2017, 02:11 PM
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Cricket tubs are expensive now you know
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