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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 08-10-2011, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul B View Post
Hmm

I assume the viv is 45 cm long rather than high.
IMO this is far too small and should be at least 60cm long x 30 x 30.
This is the viv I'm taking about: Exo Terra PT2602

It's one of the two vivs, the other being the PT2605, recommended for use with the Exo Terra Leopard Gecko Starter Kit - these two vivs' model numbers are printed on the packaging of Exo Terra's own Leo starter kit, thus I assumed it would be okay to use this viv; I'd also like to stress, however, that I'm going to start with just one gecko, and with that in-mind I thought this viv would be big enough. If that assumption was wrong, I'm glad someone had the good sense to point this out to me now, rather than scream at me later for having too small a vivarium -- Thank you, Paul.

I have since revised the master plan and gone for a shorter, sturdier table to accomodate the larger, slightly-heavier PT2605 viv which is 45cm x 45cm x 45cm. If this is still not long enough, I may be able to really stretch to a PT2610 (L61cm x D45.7 x H45.7), though this will easilly swallow most of my total budget, and may make the purchase of the starter kit a total waste of money as everything in it will either be of no use, or for entirely the wrong tank. Please see the second paragraph of post #7 for details of the height restrictions of my attic bedroom.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul B View Post
Dump the heat rock.
Buy a heat mat that is a third of the size of the base of the viv.
Buy a mat stat to ensure the mat does not get too hot.
Yeah, I thought that too, and it confused me as to why there wasn't a heat mat included in the starter kit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul B View Post
The UV is a debatable point. As Leos are nocturnal they really dont see a lot of the sun.
They need to get UV from somewhere though, right? Something about specific vitamins; it's not in either of the care books I have, but I know I read it somewhere.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul B View Post
They do need a damp hide to assist with shedding.
Yeah, I know about sphagnum moss in the moist hide; just not sure where in the temp gradient the hide should go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul B View Post
Unfortunately the "starter kits" sold by large pet superstores tend to be useless or only suitable for the first few months of the animals life.

If the employees of the business are not keen to tell you the most important things about the creatures you buy i suggest you buy them elsewhere. P
I was wary about the 'shop special' starter kits, myself, so I opted for the Exo Terra brand one. I think Paul's nicely summed up its failings, but has anyone here had actual experience with this starter kit? Please leave a comment.

Frankly, when it comes to the reptiles they stock, I think TwinPet (small, family-run business with a total of 2 shops) have a policy that goes something like, "The less we know to tell people, the happier we are." That said, I'm not all that sure the staff at TwinPet like me very much; it might be 'cause I'm frequently in the Exotics section but never actually *buy* anything. If they'd actually stopped and asked what I'm interested in, or even tried to sell me something, they'd know that my stepfather is terrified of anything that has scales, and thus, until recently my living situation hasn't enabled me to keep reptiles of any kind.

Thanks again for the stern advice, Paul. I'm slightly Autistic, and I don't always recognise the hint first-time, so I think it good when someone is blunt in stopping me and saying, "Uh, no, you're doing it wrong..."

Last edited by glazios; 08-10-2011 at 07:18 PM..
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 08-10-2011, 07:04 PM
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i have one leo and it only costs me about £10 per month depending on what food i get that mounth as locust cost a bit more than crickets and pinkies.
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Old 08-10-2011, 08:05 PM
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Personally i would get a wooden viv, i find the exo's abit hard to heat.

I'm currently selling one as all my leo's are in wooden vivs now.

There is a big debate on UV but personally i keep them without UV as they will do just fine if you correctly supplement their food
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Old 08-10-2011, 08:07 PM
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Hello and to the forum.

In all honesty, I wouldn't buy an exo terra viv for a leo, but would instead get a wooden viv, for example (though I'm sure that you can probably find a suitable viv cheaper if you shop around). There are a couple of problems with using glass vivs for leos: firstly, it can be difficult to maintain the correct temperature, as they lose heat rapidly; secondly, the glass can leave a leo feeling very exposed / vulnerable, so they often seem to thrive better in a wooden viv where they feel more secure. As a guide, a 60cm x 30cm x 30cm viv (or equivalent floor area) would be the absolute minimum I'd use for one adult leo.

In terms of the rest of the kit then, as has already been suggested, I'd be inclined to buy individual components rather than a starter kit, as the kits often lack essential pieces of equipment / contain stuff that's really unsuitable. Try checking out the information on SleepyD's website: it contains a list of all the essentials you'll need for a leo, as well as giving excellent advice on leo care. You should definitely be able to get all of the kit that you'll need for £150 (though, obviously, the total amount will vary depending on the decor you choose for the viv etc).

Leos are generally relatively cheap to care for. For one adult, you'd probably need two to three of tubs of live food per month, (which should cost no more than about £10 in total), plus sundries such as a pot of pure calcium plus a pot of Nutrobal (or similar) mineral / vitamin supplement, which you'd probably only need to buy once or twice per year if you're going to keep just one leo (these can last months, though you need to be aware of the fact that Nutrobal does have a 'use by' date and does degrade after opening) and disinfectant for cleaning the viv / decor etc (personally, I use F10SC concentrate: though it's initially more expensive to buy than the disinfectants sold in most pet shops, by the time you dilute it to the correct concentration it will last a lot longer and work out far more economical in the long run). Plus, of course, there's the other stuff that's far more difficult to budget for, such as vet bills etc (although leos are generally hardy critters, the vet bills can sometimes be quite hefty when things do go wrong, so I tend to save a set amount each month so that I have a 'pot' set aside to cover such eventualities as / when the need arises).
jools and loonymoony like this.
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Old 08-10-2011, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Yeah, I know about sphagnum moss in the moist hide; just not sure where in the temp gradient the hide should go.
Put it wherever you can get 28-31c so somewhere in warm end
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Old 08-10-2011, 08:13 PM
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I have just moved in with my missus but at my parents I had the attic room with about he same clearance you are describing and managed two snakes and 6 geckos honestly you'll be surprised what you can squeeze in if you try ha ha.

found it hard to stop at one mind, and near the end of living at home my clan spilled over into the other halfs place
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Old 08-10-2011, 09:13 PM
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hi and welcome..I would get a wooden viv look ebay etc just to get you going or make one long as it holds heat..Ebay is your best bet or gumtree you can buy everthing.. it will cost you less than £30 get started and see what happens and i bet you get more..All the best sandy
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Old 11-10-2011, 10:36 PM
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Hey guys. Had a bit of a rethink after considering everyone's advice so far, and I've decided to ditch the Exo Terra option in favour of a wooden vivarium w/ complete nocturnal setup, as sold by Reptile Cymru for £99.



FYI, the setup includes:
  • professionally-manufactured wooden vivarium, L24 x W18 x D18", w/ toughened glass doors
  • heat mat
  • thermostat
  • light fitting w/ bulb (choice of white, red, and blue)
  • substrate
  • thermometer
  • hide & water bowl
A dimmer thermostat for the light was also available for an extra £40, not sure if I'll need it.

Paid the Reptile Cymru premises a visit today to check them out and have a chat, and although it was a bit small, I was impressed with the place. The lad manning the counter seemed quite knowledgeable, and the animals on display were alert, active, happy-looking and generally seemed well looked-after.

The shop also had a good, broad range of equipment and vivarium accessories in-stock, which I consider a good thing. For what my opinion may be worth, the place gets an all-round green light, and I'd be more than happy to do business with them in the near future.

I've also decided that my first Leo should be a female standard morph; though I quite like some of the more exotic morphs – Diablo Blanco is a personal favourite, along with Blazing Blizzard – they can be expensive, and I'm not sure if certain morphs have more specific care needs, so I think it's better to be safe and start basic than be sorry a few months down the line.

What's everyone think?
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Old 11-10-2011, 11:15 PM
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I've also decided that my first Leo should be a female standard morph; though I quite like some of the more exotic morphs – Diablo Blanco is a personal favourite, along with Blazing Blizzard – they can be expensive, and I'm not sure if certain morphs have more specific care needs, so I think it's better to be safe and start basic than be sorry a few months down the line.

all morph have the same care needs and have a look on here for your leo you will get 1 cheeper and from a breeder and the set up look ok to me but see wot the leo ppl say
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2011, 08:31 PM
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That set up looks fine.

You won't need a dimmer thermostat for a leo, and only a low wattage bulb so he doesn't overheat - the viv heat is provided by the heatmat.

In fact a light isn't necessary at all if you're placing his viv in a decently lit room. They need to have an indication of the day/night cycle is all. People often use a blue or red bulb to watch their little guy at night.

So if the room is well lit, lighting is optional.

Add a thermometer to keep an eye on your temps, get his vitamins, calcium & bugs and you're good to go.
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