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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 29-10-2012, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Bradleybradleyc View Post
Sound advise Tom !

Remember people, there are different ways to get the setup working properly, so lets not argue and confuse the op too much with our different opinions ayye

Personally I'm with Jeffers3 all my stats are in my hot ends. That's the way I set up all my vivs.

Over and out !
But that's not right, they should be in the cool end! I'm joking with you! If we've all got temps that are correct then what's the issue.
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Old 29-10-2012, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by tomcannon View Post
But that's not right, they should be in the cool end! I'm joking with you! If we've all got temps that are correct then what's the issue.
The reason some people place the stat probe in the cool end is because many thermostats are badly designed for running bearded dragon vivs. The temperature scale doesn't go high enough to control the hot end properly. Somebody realised that a way around this is to place the probe in the cool end - and this has become adopted as "the way to do it". However, it isn't the best way to use a thermostat.

A thermostat is a simple device (God knows why they are so expensive - but that's another issue!). There are various ways they control the heating element, but the principle is most easily illustrated with an on/off device.

If the stat probe is in the cool end, the heater will continue heating until the set-point temperature is reached in the cool end. By this time, it could be very hot in the hot end. The thermostat would then cut the power, but since it is now very hot at the warm end, the heat continues to drift towards the cool end due to the high thermal gradient that exists. It therefore takes some time before the cool end drops back below the thermostat's lower set-point temperature, which switches the heat back on. Crucially, during this time, the temperature in the cool end can rise significantly above the thermostat control value. The further away from the heat source the probe is, the worse this effect becomes.

In order to control a heat source properly, the thermostat probe needs to be fairly close to the heat source. A good compromise (because thermostats are mostly rubbish designs) is to place the probe in the warm end, but not in the basking spot.

The whole set-up is a compromise to be honest. The long, but narrow shape of most vivs helps us with setting up a gradient, though. Ideally, we would also fit a cooling system in the cool end as well in hot weather, but since it is very rare that this is a problem in this country, most people don't do it.
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Old 29-10-2012, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by tomcannon View Post
Well I guess that's where we differ. Everyone has different ways of doing things. To be fair I don't have three thermometers either, I have one in the hot and cool end and use an infra red temp gun to measure surface temps of basking areas. However I recommended the use of three thermometers to keep things simple and assumed a temp gun wasn't available. I disagree that the stat probe should never be down the cool end. I have it placed there on the basis that it is a fail safe and will stop my viv from ever over heating (he will always have the cool side of the viv to go to if he's hot. No I wouldn't place a stat for an oven outside the oven doors but that's because you'd use an oven stat to get an oven up to temp, not to ensure a certain part of it doesn't go over a certain max temp. I use the stat in my viv to keep the cool end below a maximum temp so if the probe was situated in the hot end then I would have no way of keeping it stable. If outside forces were to increase ambient temps by a few degrees it would affect all areas of the viv. My lights simply dim more if the cool side is getting too hot, this in turn obviously lowers the basking temp with it as that would have increased slightly too in situ with the ambient.

The bulb wattage advice isn't skewed, again it just reiterates how we do things differently, I understand exactly how a thermostat works and it does the exact job I intend it too perfectly. It brings my basking spot up to temp and keeps it there while keeping my cool side at a low enough temp to allow effective thermo regulation and ensure's it will always be at an optimum temperature so I must be doing something right!

Please feel free to share as to why you believe I am doing it incorrectly as all the evidence clearly states differently. I am still learning so would like to hear if there is anything I can better, however I know how I do it works perfectly for me (and many others). I'm not denying your way doesn't as I'm sure it does for you. you set your stat up to control the basking temp level and this in turn keeps your ambient a steady temp whereas I set my stat up to control my max cool side temp which in turn keeps my basking temps steady. As said different strokes for different folks!

Sorry if it came across as critical of you. All I wanted was to advise the beginner that this isn't how a thermostat is meant to be used, that's all. I'm sure your animals are fine and dandy.

My main gripe is actually with the hopeless thermostat manufacturers in this country, who charge extortionate amounts of money for products that aren't fit for purpose. They don't even have reliable thermometers built in, or digital displays on most of them. There's no excuse for it these days - we shouldn't have to put up with 1960s technology at 2012 prices.
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Old 29-10-2012, 11:45 AM
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That's just it, a compromise of what works for you. My probe is actually just of centre towards the cool end of the viv about 10" from my secondary heat source.
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Old 29-10-2012, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeffers3 View Post
Sorry if it came across as critical of you. All I wanted was to advise the beginner that this isn't how a thermostat is meant to be used, that's all. I'm sure your animals are fine and dandy.

My main gripe is actually with the hopeless thermostat manufacturers in this country, who charge extortionate amounts of money for products that aren't fit for purpose. They don't even have reliable thermometers built in, or digital displays on most of them. There's no excuse for it these days - we shouldn't have to put up with 1960s technology at 2012 prices.
That's quite alright, I know that people will differ in their ways, its the final result that counts!
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Old 29-10-2012, 12:59 PM
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Great advice so far!

If there are anymore questions I'm happy to help.

Here is a link to our site Arcadia Reptile check out the lighting guide from the front page.

John
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Old 29-10-2012, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Arcadiajohn View Post
Great advice so far!

If there are anymore questions I'm happy to help.

Here is a link to our site Arcadia Reptile check out the lighting guide from the front page.

John

I've always supported Arcadia with my comments. I think your UV lights are fantastic (always room to lower the prices, though.... ).

Is there any chance that Arcadia will be producing heating equipment in the near future? In particular, how about decent thermostats that do what they need to - measure and display temps, control system, allow day / night settings etc..... The other main manufacturers don't seem to be bothered in supplying us with decent products, so there's a gap in the market, I reckon.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 29-10-2012, 02:03 PM
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Hi, message received and understood!

I did actually half the cost of T8 lighting this year with our "made in Germany" eurorange

Let's see what 2013 brings

Honestly, posts like thisnisnone how we get inspired to design new products, it may take a while but as long as I know what you guys want I can make plans.

Thanks again!!

John


QUOTE=Jeffers3;10647431]I've always supported Arcadia with my comments. I think your UV lights are fantastic (always room to lower the prices, though.... ).

Is there any chance that Arcadia will be producing heating equipment in the near future? In particular, how about decent thermostats that do what they need to - measure and display temps, control system, allow day / night settings etc..... The other main manufacturers don't seem to be bothered in supplying us with decent products, so there's a gap in the market, I reckon.[/QUOTE]
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 29-10-2012, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffers3 View Post

Is there any chance that Arcadia will be producing heating equipment in the near future? In particular, how about decent thermostats that do what they need to - measure and display temps, control system, allow day / night settings etc..... The other main manufacturers don't seem to be bothered in supplying us with decent products, so there's a gap in the market, I reckon.
Agreed
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Old 15-11-2012, 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Arcadiajohn View Post
Hi, message received and understood!

I did actually half the cost of T8 lighting this year with our "made in Germany" eurorange

Let's see what 2013 brings

Honestly, posts like thisnisnone how we get inspired to design new products, it may take a while but as long as I know what you guys want I can make plans.

Thanks again!!

John


QUOTE=Jeffers3;10647431]I've always supported Arcadia with my comments. I think your UV lights are fantastic (always room to lower the prices, though.... ).

Is there any chance that Arcadia will be producing heating equipment in the near future? In particular, how about decent thermostats that do what they need to - measure and display temps, control system, allow day / night settings etc..... The other main manufacturers don't seem to be bothered in supplying us with decent products, so there's a gap in the market, I reckon.
[/QUOTE]


sounds good
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