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Old 24-03-2009, 08:20 PM
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Unhappy Dog training advice please

Hello

This isn't for me, its for my mum. She has an 8month old Giant Schnauzer and he is a complete nightmare.
At 8 months old he is pretty much full grown so he's quite a big boy.
Our last dogs were Standard Schnauzers and they are quite quiet and easy going dogs, she thought the Giant would be the same. He is NOT.

This is not entirely her fault... her partner was supposed to be training him but their relationship is on the rocks and he is now hardly ever there. I do know its not an excuse, but he can handle him and she struggles.

She walks him for a few hours every day but he still has SO much energy. He is not bad when he is out on the lead, gets very excited when he sees another dog but apart from that he walks to heel and sits when you tell him. The real problems are in the house.

She doesn't really get many visits, only 1 or 2 a week and mostly its her partner but whenever someone different comes in (ie- me) he goes mental. Everything is a game, he jumps up, bites, snaps (not aggresively, its just play but because of his size he's pretty rough and it can hurt) also he's all paws so you tend to get scratched a lot also. I've tried just ignoring him but it doesn't work. He does calm down after 10-15minutes but those 10-15minutes are awful. You can shut him out the room and he'll just sit and wait at the door but obviously thats not going to help the situation.
The only times I've ever managed not to get bitten/jumped on is when he's had his collar on and I've held it so he couldn't reach to bite me. But even when he's not all wound up he often 'mouths' things.

I know she needs to put more time and effort into trying to train him, and I have told her this but she just says 'she can't' or that her partner was meant to do it. I won't even bother suggesting a dog obedience class because a- they can't afford it atm and b- even if they could they wouldn't.

I am so sick of it, its not fair on the dog. Whenever I go over I try and get him to sit and stay and lie down stuff (my sister taught him to sit and give a paw, but she's moved out now) but unless you have a biscuit (or are my mums partner) he's not very interested and to be honest I don't know the first thing about training a dog.

Is there anything I can do, or get her to do that will help teach him how to behave when people come in?

Thanks,
Gayle.
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Old 24-03-2009, 09:01 PM
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hi
i personally can not help with this one but we had some behaviour problems with our nippy jack russell and we asked a question in another forum and a pet behaviourist replied by sheer luck and he talked (or typed) us thru the process with him .. i will try and find his link for u so u contact him, it was free to by the way .. ill check back in if i can find it

good luck x
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Old 24-03-2009, 09:04 PM
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hi im back again lol

the person is on another forum called www.petforums.co.uk
his user name is ben 576

i know his advice for us was free

i think he offers house visits too (not sure tho and i think there is a fee)

but if he can write down on how to deal with the dog then i guess its worth a go

hope it turns out well for u!
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Old 24-03-2009, 09:28 PM
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Oh dear...

I can understand your frustration.

Ideally (as you have already said) he desperatly needs to go to training classes. Especially for the jumping up and nipping/biting.

I know there are people on here who will probably give advice. But I think in these situations you really need to see the dog in the flesh. And your Mum needs to be willing to do the training.
So unfortunatly unless she changes her mind about training classes there isnt allot you can do.

Otherwise he is going to stay the same or get worse. Your Mum really needs to think of him and if she will be able to cope with him behaving like this for the rest of his life? If not it will be very hard to rehome such a dog.

I know there are a few experienced dog owners and trainers on DogPages, so maybe post on there and see if anyone can help.

<Dogpages UK dog rescue forums>
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Old 24-03-2009, 10:00 PM
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yh trainin classes are perfect for him in the short term wen ever sum1 new cums to the house ignore the dog completley if e jumps up turn ure back to him and wait for him to calm down and realise he aint gettin any attention then go from there but its gonna take time
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Old 25-03-2009, 11:51 AM
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Ignoring him doesn't work. He just keeps jumping up.

Thanks for the replies, I've joined a Schnauzer forum so I'll try there first and if no one there can help then I'll try one of the other forums mentioned.

Every time I am over I tell her she needs to do something about him but she always just says the same things. I feel rotten for him though because he's not being bad he just doesn't know any better, and when he does eventually calm down he can be so nice... although it doesn't take much to get him started again. He can go from being fast asleep to bouncing off the walls in seconds.


Obviously they didn't do their reading before they got him, they said to me when they'd decided to get him that minis are just like other terriers but Giants are a lot more like Standards. They also said when he was little that they wanted to 'let him be a puppy' before they started training, but everything I've read suggests that they need training from day 1, and that without the training they don't make very good pets because they are so big and boisterous.

Sigh. I might try and find out if there is any local obedience classes and if I can afford it I could take him myself, though I will not be surprised if they wouldn't let me.
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Old 25-03-2009, 11:58 AM
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If shes the main person in the house she needs to stop saying its her partners job to train the dog and do it herself. If shes not willing to put any effort in the dog will keep doing what hes doing. He obviously has no respect for her or anyone who comes into the house.
First thing you need to do is make your mum realise SHE has to do something, no-one can fix the dog for her and take it back into the same situation, theres no point.
Youre doing all the right things like going onto a breed forum etc. but your mum needs to get involved in it too if she really wants change the dogs behaviour.
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Old 25-03-2009, 03:09 PM
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]I used to keep and breed giant schnauzers.They are not a breed for the faint hearted. They are similar in natures to Rottweilers and training should be taken seriously if they aren't to turn into bullies and out of control hooligans. If your mother won't take proper responsibility then she needs to do some serious thinking about whether she can keep the dog.
Ideally, proper training classes will be gone to and then put things into practice daily. He will challenge her and defy her and push the boundaries every day until she has him in hand. They are definately not the sort of dog to be kept in a mainly pet environment without any proper training and no direction.
Did the breeder not offer any advice at all? Did she not explain that they are an intelligent and very active breed with very strong guarding instincts? In the right hands a smashing breed to own, but in a home with weak owners and expected to behave like a docile labrador, they can be a real menace, even dangerous.
I'm not posting this to be horrible, but speaking from real experience with the breed. She is obviously not happy and ultimately, neither is the dog who is just not achieving his full working potential.
For the dog's sake, she needs to make some decisions and changes.
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Old 25-03-2009, 03:23 PM
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If she has access to the internet, i would advise watching a couple of this guys videos and just do the sit, stay, down technique to the point your bored to death of being so possitive. A lot is about your attitude as the trainer and not special ways to train them not to be bad.

YouTube - Buster and Clair - Pups at Bootcamp
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Old 25-03-2009, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenwoman View Post
]I used to keep and breed giant schnauzers.They are not a breed for the faint hearted. They are similar in natures to Rottweilers and training should be taken seriously if they aren't to turn into bullies and out of control hooligans. If your mother won't take proper responsibility then she needs to do some serious thinking about whether she can keep the dog.
Ideally, proper training classes will be gone to and then put things into practice daily. He will challenge her and defy her and push the boundaries every day until she has him in hand. They are definately not the sort of dog to be kept in a mainly pet environment without any proper training and no direction.
Did the breeder not offer any advice at all? Did she not explain that they are an intelligent and very active breed with very strong guarding instincts? In the right hands a smashing breed to own, but in a home with weak owners and expected to behave like a docile labrador, they can be a real menace, even dangerous.
I'm not posting this to be horrible, but speaking from real experience with the breed. She is obviously not happy and ultimately, neither is the dog who is just not achieving his full working potential.
For the dog's sake, she needs to make some decisions and changes.
All the reading I've done on the internet says the exact same as what you have said, I really don't know why they thought a Giant would be the same as the Standards except bigger. Standards are also very intelligent but definitely no where near as active, absolutely everything I've read says 'giants are very energetic and need training from a young age'.
Daegan doesn't seem to have much of a guarding instinct yet.

I went over today and Marc, her partner, was there. There was a noticable difference in his behaviour- Daegan actually listens to Marc.

I really appreciate your response and I have been trying to tell her this but its just not sinking in. TBH I do understand whats wrong on her part and its very sad and personal issues, but I know this is not an excuse which is why I am trying to more pro-active.

All he can do so far is sit and heel. And if you have a biscuit he'll give a paw. But thats IT. And he won't respond at all when he's all wound up (except to Marc). He doesn't even know 'down' or 'stay'.

I am thinking about offering to pay for a course of obedience classes, and I have been looking at some local classes. I would take him myself but as Daikenkai said, there wouldn't be much point. Hopefully I'll manage to persuade her.
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