Reptile Forums banner
1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So how much weight do they lose during brumation? Three pure Variable and one Variable x Ruthvens Kingsnakes all went into brumation on 30th November and out of brumation on 28th February.

Ash: In = 95g, Out = 96g
Convict: In = 168g, Out = 171g
Sandy Mae: In = 104g, Out = 103g
Madam Butterfly: In = 124g, Out = 124g

I can only presume that the slight weight gains are from having nothing to do for 3 months except work on their hydration!

The room I brumated them was at 15°C on 28th Feb but did drop below 10°C during the snowiest weather. Convict, Sandy Mae and Madam Butterfly have all been put together in a vivarium as a breeding group. The vivarium has a cool hide made from slate underneath the water bowl which is at 15°C according to the temperature gun, which is where I put them all. The warm end is 23°C with the intention of allowing them to warm up slowly. Both girls have bypassed the gradual increase options, are now climbing on the light fixture cages at the top of the vivarium which are 30-35°C and they're both very interested in movement. They are HUNGRY! Convict has gone back into the cold slate cave, hopefully as an instinctive act to maintain the quality of his swimmers.

349122

Ash - Variable x Ruthvens Kingsnake (Lampropeltis leonis x Lampropeltis ruthveni) CB2016 ♂ Aberrant(?) Leonis phase het pastelking from Shah Foladi snakes

349123

Convict - Variable Kingsnake (Lampropeltis leonis) CB2016 ♂ Leonis phase from Shah Foladi snakes

349124

Sandy Mae - Variable Kingsnake (Lampropeltis leonis) CB2016 ♀ Peach Leonis phase from Shah Foladi snakes, bred by Rick's Colubrids

349125

Madam Butterfly - Variable Kingsnake (Lampropeltis leonis) CB2016 ♀Red Leonis phase from Shah Foladi snakes, bred by Rick's Colubrids
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,103 Posts
You could send a PM to one of our other members and ask him ... Pete Johnson breeds and cools his Kings down .




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Do some searching on the forum.I read it on here years ago with a scientific explanation.
It was a bit of a rhetorical question.

How much weight do they lose during brumation? I've stated the answer: only one lost one gram, the rest maintained or gained.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,103 Posts
Jesus please don’t start posting rhetorical questions... we have enough to cope with dealing with all the fake , made up queries .

:)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,293 Posts
I love variable kingsnakes!
We need to see more, please keep posting pictures :D
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bombjack

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I love variable kingsnakes!
We need to see more, please keep posting pictures :D
I could turn this into my variable kingsnake dump post I suppose! Here's a few photos of the 3 pure variables exploring their viv now that they're out of brumation:

349154

Convict exploring.

349156

Sandy Mae and Madam Butterfly having a nose about.

349157

Sandy Mae was so tired after exploring that she slept like this. She's not dead, honest! Both of the girls had no interest in warming up slowly. Madam Butterfly has been coming out of hiding and using the climbing branch to sit at the top of the enclosure every day to get maximum warmth. Within 30 mins of lights on/daytime heat increase she comes out from hides that are 20°C and goes straight up there, where she gets up to 28-30°C during the day. Within 20 mins of lights out she dissappears back into a hide.

It reminds me of speaking to a guy years ago who bred tortoises. He didn't believe in "slowly warming up after brumation", giving the explanation that the hibernaculum warms up to the point where the animal wakes up, then it generally goes straight out to bask and eat whenever the weather permits, as much as it possibly can.

Either way, I wouldn't get to watch this behaviour if they were in a rack.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I do have a rack for babies/growing on.

349158

Del Monte is my fruity little monster. The biggest and fastest growing of all the 2020 babies. He's 66% poss het albino (leonis with some ruthveni) and I absolutely love his peach colouring and cherry red head!

349159

Ruby is Del Monte's full sister. She's not even close to being as big as him, despite having had the same care and stepping up to fuzzies at the same time. She's also 66% poss het albino (leonis x ruthveni) and is the only Milk Snake Phase I have. This phase doesn't seem as popular as the narrower banded leonis phase like Del Monte. Not sure why, she's actually my favourite of the lot I'm growing on. She's fab to handle.

349160

Prince Charming is a cute little albino leonis (some ruthveni blood in there) that I'm going to pair with Ruby eventually. He's another very sweet snake to handle and his heart shaped head stamp is adorable. I do also have his full sister to pair with Del Monte, but she's not easy to photograph. She's very flighty, bigger, has less red markings that are narrower and spaced further apart.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,293 Posts
They are so beautiful! Glad to see someone working with them.

Do you find they musk a lot? It's the one thing that puts me off getting more kingsnakes/milksnakes.
Are you keeping the two females together? How have you found they do with co-habitation? :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
They are so beautiful! Glad to see someone working with them.

Do you find they musk a lot? It's the one thing that puts me off getting more kingsnakes/milksnakes.
Are you keeping the two females together? How have you found they do with co-habitation? :)
You get two main groups of kingsnakes;

"Getula" kingsnakes, which include your Cali kings, MBK's, speckled and chain kings, and they're the bigger (5ft or so), much more cannibalistic group and in my experience/opinion, much more bad tempered and bitey.

"Mexicana" kingsnakes, which includes your Mex-mex, variable, grey banded, ruthvens and they're much smaller (3ft or so), not as cannibalistic and in my opinion, way nicer. You can even get a melanistic form of variable that's jet black, like a mini, less bitey MBK. They're mostly mountain species where it gets pretty cool in winter, so the instinct to brumate can be pretty strong. My adults were getting less and less interested in food during Sept/October, last offered opportunity to eat is end of October, into brumation end of November, out of brumation at end of February.

Mine have never musked, and I think Prince Charming's sister bit me once, but she's a VERY flighty hatchling, so it wasn't anything to get excited about.

The two girls and Convict are together in a viv for breeding. The best care sheet I've found for these is Coastal Bend Captive Breeding's combined care sheet for the whole Mexicana group.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,293 Posts
You get two main groups of kingsnakes;

"Getula" kingsnakes, which include your Cali kings, MBK's, speckled and chain kings, and they're the bigger (5ft or so), much more cannibalistic group and in my experience/opinion, much more bad tempered and bitey.

"Mexicana" kingsnakes, which includes your Mex-mex, variable, grey banded, ruthvens and they're much smaller (3ft or so), not as cannibalistic and in my opinion, way nicer. You can even get a melanistic form of variable that's jet black, like a mini, less bitey MBK. They're mostly mountain species where it gets pretty cool in winter, so the instinct to brumate can be pretty strong. My adults were getting less and less interested in food during Sept/October, last offered opportunity to eat is end of October, into brumation end of November, out of brumation at end of February.

Mine have never musked, and I think Prince Charming's sister bit me once, but she's a VERY flighty hatchling, so it wasn't anything to get excited about.

The two girls and Convict are together in a viv for breeding. The best care sheet I've found for these is Coastal Bend Captive Breeding's combined care sheet for the whole Mexicana group.


That's interesting to read, thank you.

I don't mind the biting, it's the musking which puts me off haha! :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,293 Posts
Same. I think my amazon tree boa is broken, he musks instead of bites. I wish he'd just bite instead 😭
haha
I couldn't cope with my amazon's if they musked, only one bites which i'm fine with lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
349857

Madam Butterfly has had her post brumation/pre ovulation shed, has coloured up wonderfully, is eating like a bottomless pit and hopefully she'll lay some eggs at some point this spring! I think she's a stunner.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
293 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
349858

Might as well add a feeding video still of my female albino variable. This is Mad Madam Mim, she's Prince Charming's full sibling from the same clutch. She's got much fewer markings than him and they're narrower, on a lighter coloured background. The albinism is due to ruthveni blood being crossed in.
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top