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Discussion Starter #1
hi all,

we have just got our royal a couple of days ago, we first put him on aspen, he's in a plastic fanarium, with a 8w heat mat underneath, i tested the temp and substrate temp was 30 degrees i thought was fine, then we where recommended bark to help with humidity, does this need boiling first before putting it in the viv aswell as we bought it in bulk. we put some in last night and even with a very slightest of slight substrate covering bottom of viv the subsrate temp is only 25 degrees, would a 12w heat mat sort this problem and get temp up? or revert back to aspen?

would a 12w need a thermostate as i figured the surface temp was fine on aspen so didnt get one.

thanks alot a help appreciated.:)
 

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the only reason i can think of that would account for the apparent drop in temps could be that since bark is moist then there will be evapouration and hence cooling occuring. be careful as the bark dries out the temps will rise.
all heating equipment should be on a thermostat, with out one if any heating fluctuations happen your snake will get burnt.

and its recommended to treat the bark either by freezing it or boiling, microwaving etc to to ensure there are no nasties.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
so what do you think will be the best solution then?

get a 12w and set up with a mat stat?

would 12w bring temps up tho?

thanks: victory:
 

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to be honest if you were getting the right temps before and the mat is the right size (covering a third to half of your enclosure) then the temps should come ok again but you really do need a thermostat even on the smaller one.

what are you using to measure temps? like i said evapouration will make the surface temperature appear cooler but when it dries then the temps will rise.

the wattage of the mats is in proportion to the size so doesn't generally lend itself to more heat.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
thanks, just watching i have placed a dial guage in for now, i know there rubbish but its starting to up again, so should i mist the viv daily? will this bring temp down tho? and not have a correct "hot spot available"? is 30 ok for day temp and 25 night temp?

also is it now best to boil bark and then let it dry before putting in? or just put in wet?

will put mat on a stat too.

thanks.

:)
 

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you need a gradient throughout the viv/tub 30 is great for warm end and about 26/7 for cool end get a good digital in/out thermometer you can get them for about a 10er of ebay that have a humitiy guage built in to be honest you shouldn't need to mist unless the royal is in shed, they don't need high humidity, and i'd let the bark dry a bit before putting it in moist fine, wet might cause problems.
 

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Whatever size mat you have you need a stat so the snake won't be cooked when the house gets very warm. You also need a mat that will provide enough heat when the house is very cold. So if the current mat on full power is only just enough to heat the viv when it's normal, it sounds like you need a bigger mat to cater for really cold nights. It does need a stat though.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
thanks,

the only reason it isn't on a stat was i have the exact same heat mat for our corn and that runs at the same temp at full belt and its winter and the house isn't overly warm and he is always next to us so we monitor temps but to be on the safe side am getting a stat during the week as i dont want to risk it with him being a heavy bodied snake. i got a 12w heat mat today temps just seem to be the same tho????? or is it just until bark looses a bit moisture as i put some new in before that i boiled this morning and let dry out a bit today,

thanks a lot everyone,


:no1:
 

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your corn should have a stat as well.

like what was already said, the size of the matt is proportional to the number of watts it gives out. Only difference now is, it can provide extra warmth over a larger surface area. I'm not really sure why your readings are so low.

The dial thermometer could be the cause of this. Does it even feel warm on the substrate?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
no it doesnt,
mat feels warm tho, and reading with aspen is correct at 30 degrees, i have check temp with my digi in/out thermometer and it was reading same as dial, i was really shocked as they are meant to be cr*p. but reads the same. i'll give it tonight and tommorrow and see how it goes, its feeding time for him tonight so if he holds it down temps are fine?????

or how can you tell temp is too cool?

thanks
 

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NEVER , EVER run any sort of heating without a thermostat.

You run the risk of cooking your animals if you do

John
 

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Discussion Starter #12
checked the temp during the night and it dropped to 25 degrees,

it went upto 30 before lights out, is this ok?

also what temp does "cooking of your animals occur?"

ta
 

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Exposed lengths of time at 90f - or 32c - are said to cause neurological damage in Corn Snakes.

Think of it this way. You're away on an all inclusive holiday. It's bliss. You have everything you want. Your meals are done for you, your cleaning is done for you, and it's all to make your stay as nice as possible.

So you head down to the beach for the day, beneath the beating sun. 2 hours pass by and it feels so nice, you decide to have a wee sleep. You wake up hours later, having bathed in the midday sun. Your chest and belly is burnt and already blistering badly.

You can get up and walk back to your hotel room and apply after sun lotion, and rehydrate yourself. Would you, like a snake would with a burnt belly, like to move about on wood shavings, or sand on your blistered wounds and burns?

Please get a stat. You owe it to your snake as its owner.
 

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anything above 95F can cause neurological damage in royals, if exposed to for extended periods of time as well.

I still don't understand your readings too well. Royals will do okish at 30 deg c, but i don't feel very convinced this is what you're getting, especially since you have no stat, or any control over whats going on. What kind of digital thermometer are you using? I wouldn't trust your judgement on those dials, especially for reading surface temperatures (these should only be used as guidance for ambient temperatures anyway)
 

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also you say you are getting 30 degrees on the surface of the aspen for your corn bearing in mind that corns will burrow what temps are under the substrate? get stats please!
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Temp on bottom of viv for corn is 35 degrees, i have checked using an in/out digital thermometer, even if i did (i'm getting two today tho) had a thermostate i would still want it to read 30 degrees on the top of the substrate. so even in this case it is going to be 35 degrees on the bottom of the viv, so how does this make a difference if it doesnt ever go over 30 on the substrate? as its always going to be 35 degrees on the bottom.

Also do snakes not thermo regulate and when they get too warm move? as they do in the wild, as it seems my corn is never on the heat mat anyway.

checked royal with digital guage and its 28 degrees, surface temp is this ok? ideally in what range should it be?

will get two thermostates today tho just incase.


thanks
 

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thanks its good to talk to some one who welcomes advice.
the problem with snakes is that they don't sense heat very well from below (in the wild its from above)so they can and do sit and burn.
corns really don't need 30c let alone 35 it's good that it hasn't used warm end you probably wouldn't have it now if it did.i'd be looking at 30/32 under substrate to get around 28 on top for the corn. for the royal they don't burrow and need a slightly higher temp so you need 30 on the top of substrate. has it dried out now?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
how do you best set up sensor then? suitable to just place on heat mat outside of plastic viv until temp is fine inside?

thanks
 

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That's how we do it. You can put inside the viv... here's a picture of how i've got things ticking over... We use multiple matts per stat. So as you can see i have a thermometer on the one above, and thermostat probe below that one. Now, obviously, the temperature will differ inside the tub, but i've done so many checks, and have a temperature stable room, i'm confident what the outside (heat matt), and inside temperatures (basking spot) are. So if i were you i'd have your thermometer probe on the substrate to check it's reaching it's target temps.

 
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