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I would have thought it would thrash around ,break the web and fall to the ground!
 

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if you look at the snake it looks as tho it has an injury(3rd pic) that i doubt the spider could have done. maybe it was dead when before it was in the webb
 

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yeh but the black widow could of killed it with its venom/poison whatever its called. that black widow looks big or is the snake small?? I though black widows were TINY.
 

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maybe its a veyr small hatchling, and that how its light enough not to pull the web down
 

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black widows are tiny but the females are a bit bigger, also the snake is small and the venom from the spider would easilly have killed it, but the question is HOW THE HELL DID IT GET IN THE WEB?
no way the spider could have moved it there
 

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spider web is very very strong.. TBH if the snake had thrashed around it wouldn't really ahve broken the web BUT a fem,ale black widow is not massive so I'm guessing this snake was also a little hatchling!
 

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a quick estimate and i would say that the snake is around 4-6 inch long (given the size of the widdow) and the wound could have been there before, or it could have been inflicted by the venom of the widow,because the BW's venom is contains a-Latrotoxin(sp), a neuro toxin that causes not only paralysis, but it can aslo cause local swelling and burn like wounds becaseu of its tendancy to cause cells to relase hormones, killing the cells and forming a strong solution of acid (simalar to lactic in composition, but pH2 (very strong). and due also to the digestive enzymes that allow the spired to drink the "goodness" out of the prey item
the other effects would be near instant paralisis, sroping the thrashin. if you look at the web it is intact but damaged, a symptom of thrashing for a limited tim.

the dose to kill a mamal (mouse) is 0.001mg per gram. even if the snake has a higher tolerance, its mass would be only 50-60g, so 0.05-0.1 mg would be enough to kill it, and they are capable of a 10-12mg injection of venom.

to put this into perspective, the venom of a BW is considered 15 time more potant than that of a diamond back rattlesnake.

i had to double cheak some of the numbers, but BW's are my fav invert, so i know alot of that beforehand...for anyone who cares :)

i pic of the "burn" at the site of a bite.
[imghttp://www.ecureme.com/atlas/data/dis_images/Black_widow_Spider_Bite550_ab.jpg[/img]
 

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hi im new to these forums just wanted to say i keep a spider and a snake so i know a fair bit about both :) most of my time is spent watching animal programs researching online and in books etc :) just 1 of the questions i think i can answer is how the snake got up in the web. the bw spins a unique web its not a normal spiders web it is like a dome with the web silk dangling down to the ground or a tree branch etc depending where the web is situated these bits of silk are strung down really tightly and they work by when 1 breaks because some prey has gone through it the silk shoots up with a force bringing the prey up to the dome so this snake could easily have broken a couple threads in a struglle after breaking 1 forcing the snake of the ground suspended in numerous points helpless the bw :) sorry that was long winded lol just thought some may find it interesting
 

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hi im new to these forums just wanted to say i keep a spider and a snake so i know a fair bit about both :) most of my time is spent watching animal programs researching online and in books etc :) just 1 of the questions i think i can answer is how the snake got up in the web. the bw spins a unique web its not a normal spiders web it is like a dome with the web silk dangling down to the ground or a tree branch etc depending where the web is situated these bits of silk are strung down really tightly and they work by when 1 breaks because some prey has gone through it the silk shoots up with a force bringing the prey up to the dome so this snake could easily have broken a couple threads in a struglle after breaking 1 forcing the snake of the ground suspended in numerous points helpless the bw :) sorry that was long winded lol just thought some may find it interesting
 

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mikeuk1986 said:
hi im new to these forums just wanted to say i keep a spider and a snake so i know a fair bit about both :) most of my time is spent watching animal programs researching online and in books etc :) just 1 of the questions i think i can answer is how the snake got up in the web. the bw spins a unique web its not a normal spiders web it is like a dome with the web silk dangling down to the ground or a tree branch etc depending where the web is situated these bits of silk are strung down really tightly and they work by when 1 breaks because some prey has gone through it the silk shoots up with a force bringing the prey up to the dome so this snake could easily have broken a couple threads in a struglle after breaking 1 forcing the snake of the ground suspended in numerous points helpless the bw :) sorry that was long winded lol just thought some may find it interesting
i was under the impression that the southern black widow (this spider) spun a normal web sucha as any orb web spider would, the cousin of the BW, the australian red back however spins the web you discribed quite accuratly, but the strenght in the web is limited, because it is only a single stand, and breaks if anything larger than an ant touches it, the method would be good to see with a larger prey, meals on bungee eh??? i think that it is more likely that the snake was in the tree/bush, and slithered into the upper reaches of the web, and the spider bit it on the side, causing the snake to thrash in responce, tangleing it in the web. the spider then went on to wrap it up for lare, as show in the last pic (which best displays the relative size.


correction
the black widdow weeves a 3dimentional web, that is designed to trap small to medium sized insects, this web can be bigger than 1 cubic foot, and has numerous connecting strands to make a interweeved box. this is nearly impossible to fly through for any insect.

trusty encyclopedia on hand... :D
 
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