i think its an awesome idea, people can see what anatomey there snake has, the teeth ect would be brilliant and also they look really kool, i have a few skulls but no reptile ones i would buy a few depending on the price

 

As a vegetarian, I don't agree with killing animals for skins etc so can't say I agree with it for the bones either.
I wouldn't be offended, I'd take a look cos I'd find them interesting to look at but I wouldn't buy any.

 

Sorry, you actually think he kills snakes to get the skins/skeletons? mg:

 

I s that the place that nails the snake to the tree to die?

 

I was quite interested when I saw some of your pics in various posts. I did wonder how you did it..now you mention "Cleaner Beetles" it makes sense.

I would certainly buy skulls etc, especially something like a GTP.

Could you answer a question for me?
How do people like yourself, create something like this...and how does it stay together?

http://www.urbanjungles.com/DSC09002.jpg

 

I was quite interested when I saw some of your pics in various posts. I did wonder how you did it..now you mention "Cleaner Beetles" it makes sense.

I would certainly buy skulls etc, especially something like a GTP.

Could you answer a question for me?
How do people like yourself, create something like this...and how does it stay together?

http://www.urbanjungles.com/DSC09002.jpg

Hiya,

My guess is a lot of time &patience, they use super glue &/or a wire frame I think

regards, emmie x

 

You might have difficulty even taking them in TBH, as at Kempton they banned all sale of WC animals, and I would have thought that they woud do the same for animal parts.

I guess it would be more ammunition for the antis if they found out.

Also, I would have thought wild caught and killed animal parts would be a little distastful at a rep show personally.

However, I'm just a little biased, as I'm not too keen on killing things to make ornaments out of, if that is all it is used for. Plus, it doesn't sound all that sustainable, and that post of them nailing them to trees sounds a bit disturbing.

However, I do like your work on the animals that have died of natural causes though :no1:

 

imo its better that they get used for something positive than tossed away in a bucket

i for one would buy a skull to show myself and my visitors the physical make up of a snakes head,jaws,teeth,etc

as has been said over in indonesia this trade puts food on the table for familys and their children

although i don't condone killing snakes for the skin trade etc i understand why the locals do it

unlike us privaliged folk in the west who can get a job and pop down to asda for our shopping they don't have the same opertunity's in indonesia

its not like the reason these snakes died was for their skulls they were already being culled for other reasons

the skulls are merely a by product of the skin industry

imo the skulls would be good educational talking points sitting in your snake room

cheers shaun

 

pmd

And re the question posed, i would imagine people would buy them, you get alot of 'wierd' 'gothic' 'alternative' 'chavvy' 'extremes of society' that are into reptiles, and alot of those people would probably put skulls on their mantelpiece:gasp:. Personally though i think id just use it as a paperweight on my desk:whistling2:

 

Now if they where the replica ones made by bone clones no problem but to be selling parts from wc and inhumainly killed snakes is not going to go down very well and would bring bad press to both the hobby and the shows/organisers! This is not what breeders shows are about!

 

i would be interested in skulls and skins, but I doubt they would let you sell them at a show

 

i think you would make loads of sales if you sold them on here but a show would be a bad idea.can you stuff a snake?ie if an adult royal died could you stuff it as a display piece

 

any chance you could awnser my question :2thumb:

 

I would definitely buy some, they would be amazing to have on show.

 

Me and scaley have been sat on a dead jag for bloody ages. we wanted the skin as it was soo pretty, and you couldve had the skeleton. Unfortunately, our frozen corpse ended up in the bin on saturday!:bash:

 

=/ I pmed you and him a couple of times and had no response back so assumed it was already gone.

 

im looking forward to getting my retic skull

 

Once your established and well known for what you do it may be easier for you to source dead animals that have died of natural causes anyway. You could post a thread here asking if anyone has any animals they wouldn't mind sending you?

 

I would say as fascinating as I find them, I simpy couldn't in good conscience buy a product that has come from culled wc stocks. As to me that is supporting the trade, fair enough some species are so abundant in captivity that they will never become fully extinct but the same people that you would be getting your common skull supplies from are the same people that will pick anything up for a pretty skin. I agree with the phrase conservation through captive bred population, and as much as possible. I am one that is living in the hope one day no more wild reps will need to be caught (yes it a long way off and no I'm not against the keeping of wc species for captive breeding purposes) so don't and won't purchase or support anyone directly linked to such things.

I love your work and actually think a better route to go would be casts of the skulls you have, now there is a challenge. Also it feels wrong you taking anything financial from the skulls you have done as they were donated to you.

I wouldn't be pleased if I did see such a stall and what is still ment to be a breeders meeting, meaning stuff useful to breeders and for the keeping of reps. This to me has no place at breeders meeting. I would hate them to become like the stalls at crufts, selling things that are in no way related to the original show.

Anyway there is my 2 pence worth.

 

Not sure if this has been suggested, but perhaps if you put a heavy emphasis on education you may get under the radar of the tree hugging hippies warped, misguided, dumb ass 'pro welfare' campaign. Genuinely though, a few nicely put together labels, maybe an accompanying pamphlet could take make all the difference to their judgment. I personally don't see a single problem with using dead animals in this way, providing of course they did not solely die for the use! Allot of this will boil down to presentation.

 

I've seen your work and, having been a keen student of taxidermy myself in my youth, admire your obvious skills! HOWEVER Whilst preserving the bodies (or body parts) of animals that have died from natural causes or accident is totally acceptable it is morally reprehensible to kill any wild animal soley for it's fur, feathers, skin, fin or indeed skull. To offer specimens aquired this way at a reptile breeders show would not only be insulting to many but potentially hazardous to you and your table. This barbaric practice can not only provoke strong condemnation but also possible violent reaction. Ask any vivisectionist.

 

The last bit is very true, i once asked a few questions of uncaged campigns in basildon high street and was followed by a couple of there people with the intention of at the very least trying to scare the crap out of me. Failed badly for them but its the sort of thing we simply do not need at breeders shows, to much head as it is..

 

Anyway, I didn't realize the methods behind capturing and killing said snakes was so brutal, obviously I need to do more research.

 

Yuck. so no. not for me. good luck with the whole thing anyways.

 

Yuck.

:rotfl::roll2: Best thing anyone's said so far.

 

have you thought about bringing ure show pieces to a show?

have a table so people know what you do and either let people bring there reptiles to the table on the day or arrange to get it to you some other way after and then figure out what to charge for what people want.also let people bring stuff to youre stall that they dont want and pay them an amount for it so you can do all you need to to it and then sell it on

 

Still would bring the same anti attacks we simply do not need, it just does not sit well with selling live captive bred reptiles.

 

About as much as some stupid comment about killing them himself you mean?

What are you on about? An example of how I would kill a snake? Chopping it's head off? That was rude to you, or hurtful? You seem half awake or something, perhaps just thick. My intentions behind explaining how I would kill a snake were based upon the ridiculousness of keeping it alive while skinning it. In any case, it was a "if I had to" sort of situation.

 

Personally, I would imagine you would get more buisiness taking orders from people who's pets have died. Also, as many have said it would be disgraceful to support such a barbaric treatment of wild caught animals. Having been out to south east Asia, and meeting locals who used to perform these practices, it's very understandable why they would do these things, even though I do not condone them.

At the end of the day, they are at the bottom rung of this whole industry, and like so many other trades such as the production of drugs, they are simply doing it to make ends-meet, and that usually is a battle in itself.

The only solution is to discourage the local communities, and educate them on the importance of conservastion. And perhaps more importantly in their eyes is to provide them with a positive way of making an income, such as within the eco-tourism industry. But I digress...

My 2p-bring examples of cb specimins, and take orders on pets.

 

you would be best off with only the Natural ones, But I would personally say that it would be better to focus on the bone cleaners that way people could do it to whatever bones they wanted.


I dont see a problem with naturally dead ones...


But then everyone has their own opinions.
:war:

 

Apologies if i have missedanything relevant, i skipped a few pages..

I think you would seriously be better sticking to doing peoples pets that have died of natural causes, and tailoring what you do to be a bespoke service, at a cost that reflects the hours of work you have put in and the quality results.

Honestly, buying in animals dubiously killed for the wild skin trade doesn't sit well at all and is liable to keep you out of shows, and not earn you anywhere near as much, financially or respect wise.

Doing something specialist in a small way and doing it extremely well will create demand, which pushes up your prices and reputation.

Doing something ';mass produced' with controversially sourced materials... bad plan I think.

(I do know a little about small businesses doing bespoke, 'to order' specialised things)

 

i do not think an animal should be JUST killed for the skull or skin , but if it has died of natural causes then why not use the various bit's or if the skin and skull are a by product of food then fine .........and if i knew the skull and skeleton was from an old snake that had passed then i would have a skull .

 

Thread tidied- keep it on topic and stop being petty please folks.

OP, I personally would be pretty disgusted to see skulls, skins or other by-products from wild caught and butchered snakes at a show. As said earlier, the practice is cruel, unsustainable and wasteful.

Stick to captives that have died naturally or been pts.